"Double D" hole cam lock virutally pickproof??

[jozq15]

I already posted a request for information on the "Double D" hole cam lock. I immediately got a response with very helpful information. On the other hand, I have no clue how to pick this lock. The information from Han Fey explains that the lock is virtually pickproof. I refuse to believe it cannot be done. Can anyone produce anything on this?

thanks!!

[Squelchtone]

I already posted a request for information on the "Double D" hole cam lock. I immediately got a response with very helpful information. On the other hand, I have no clue how to pick this lock. The information from Han Fey explains that the lock is virtually pickproof. I refuse to believe it cannot be done. Can anyone produce anything on this?

thanks!!

In the future, you can continue that thread instead of starting a new one, it makes searching for a topic much easier.

That lock is not called a Double D lock, so let's start with that. Most cam locks can be ordered in different shapes so that they fit into a hole in a cabinet door properly. that double d shape is like this

(_) double D

(_| single D

and so on. a lot of metal doors on spam games, arcade games, tool boxes, etc have a punch out in the metal so you can quickly remove a lock and put in a new one without having to get out the drill bits and make a new hole. the flat surfaces on the hole in the metal door the lock is being inserted into keep the lock from free spinning so that you cant just walk up with a screw driver and turn the entire lock to open the door.

What I believe you are talking about is an Abloy cam lock. and yes, you are not going to pick those using a $30 Southord pick set. Normal pick sets are meant for lifting pin tumblers to the proper heights so a shearline can be created and when that happens the plug is free to turn and the lock opens.

Abloy does not use pin tumblers so it cannot be picked with a regular pick set because it doesnt depend on the idea of making a sheer line to open the lock.

Abloy disc detainer locks (including their cam locks) use a series of flat metal discs smaller than the buttons on your shirt, and each disc plate has a circular notch cut out of it on the perimeter in 1 of x different places and looks like someone took a bite out of a cookie or something. Once those 11 discs are stacked on each other and put inside a lock, there's no way to see where their 11 cut outs are on the edges of the discs but if you insert the correct key which has different angle depths cut on it, turning the key will only turn each disc until it butts up against the cut on that key and if the key is the correct one for that lock, the round cut outs on the edge of all 11 discs will now align, and turning the lock further allows this metal bar to fall into those cut outs in the discs and the metal bar no longer stops the lock from being able to turn, and you can rotate it to the open position.

Now, you can of course go in with some sort of hook pick and try to rotate each of the 11 discs 1 by 1 for hours and hours hoping you happen on the correct combination of how many degrees to turn each disc, but I honestly dont think you would be able to get very far since the lock doesnt offer much feed back on how your progress is going.

There are tools out there that insert into an Abloy lock (usually the Classic abloy mechanism, the newer ones I dont think can be opened using these tools) and the tool decodes each disc one disc at a time, then you make some notes of what the tool read out said, and you go back to the van or the shop and make a working key, but that tool itself is just a decoder, it wont pick the lock while youre sitting there in the field.

So stand in awe, because sure enough, these locks can't be picked.

Squelchtone

[Olson Burry]

If it is a disk detainer mechanism then something like this would be required however genuine abloy locks are higher security than these.

There are some vids on youtube of the disk detainer pick in action.

In actual fact, you may find this thread useful as well, there is a link to one of my posts where I took a disk detainer apart in there and also a good idea towards the end.

[Squelchtone]

If it is a disk detainer mechanism then something like this would be required however genuine abloy locks are higher security than these.

Olson is correct, Abloy knock offs which also use these disc detainers, but are not made nearly as well as a real Abloy lock, can be picked using the tools in the link.

I received an ABA brand disc detainer vending machine lock from someone and when I saw the key I started laughing, it only had 2 cuts on the entire key, the rest was a blank key. So you can see why it would be easier to probe that lock and open it.

note the number of cuts on the real Abloy key, and the number of cuts on what I like to call the Fabloy (fake abloy) key.



cheers,
Squelchtone

[illusion]

It might be worth bearing on mind that some of the cheaper disk locks often have discs of quite shockingly varying sizes.

I was able to open a Blackspur disk lock using two pieces of wire and a selection of hook picks to reach around the already set disks (I believe it was that brand at any rate) I sliced the lock apart to make a cut-away after opening it, and realised how it had been possible to open it.

[jozq15]

Everyone, I appreciate your time and knowledge you spared. It doesn't look like the authentic abloys can be picked. It would be quite an accomplishment to do it, but the locks are really an intelligent invention.

thanks,

Jose