Riddle me this

[Twisted T]

Lately I've been seeing a lot of info. about bump keys and how they work.
While I realize that they've been around for a long time what makes them so special?
After all aren't they doing the same thing as a snap gun or electric pick gun?
I just watched a training video about raking and it appears to me that it's doing what
the bump key does minus the bumping. In the video it showed how raking is using kinetic force to move the pins into position so as to allow the plug to turn.
So why then do we need a bump keying system? It seems to me that it's far more fun to pick than to bump (That sounded weird didn't it?) any way what are your thoughts?

[cledry]

Bump keys can be practical for very convoluted keyways where a pick gun wouldn't work. I try not to use them in my work as it doesn't look professional, but neither does picking a lock and taking more than 10 minutes to get the job done. I suppose it is different if picking is a hobby rather than a way to put bread on the table.

[raimundo]

What makes them so special? The media has found them, they like a scary story, FUD fear uncertainty and doubt is their job

"Why do we need them"? well we dont actually, a simple wire snapper from bike spoke can do exactly what they do and there is no need to carry around a huge ring of bump keys to fit every occasion.

I would be very happy if everyone would just forget bump keys but they keep bringing them up.

These things are very attractive to those who are handicapped by a the "I cant do that" attitude and therefor will never learn to pick.

Its for the lazy, it makes them feel powerful until they experience reality outside the dark cave lit by the computer screen.

[Twisted T]

I whole heartedly agree with you about forgetting the bump key thing.
BTW I can and have been picking with some success. And you answered what I was thinking about a snap gun or other object can do the same thing so why then do we need them? Mostly IMO the only ones who do need them are the criminals.
I just figure that a good locksmith wouldn't or shouldn't have need of them again just my opinion.

[cledry]

I whole heartedly agree with you about forgetting the bump key thing.
BTW I can and have been picking with some success. And you answered what I was thinking about a snap gun or other object can do the same thing so why then do we need them? Mostly IMO the only ones who do need them are the criminals.
I just figure that a good locksmith wouldn't or shouldn't have need of them again just my opinion.

Well put it this way, you are a locksmith, you work in Florida in the blazing sun. Your job that day is to open and make keys to 75 trailers, 2 locks per that are being shipped to Haiti the next day. The locks sit about 6 to seven feet off of the ground. You can bump the lock in perhaps 10 seconds to 30 seconds on average or you can try single pin picking over your head.

I don't know which you as a hobbyist would pick as you have all day to practice on a lock and it doesn't cost you money, but I know I do what it takes to get the job done in the fastest easiest manner.

No a snapper will not do the same as a bump key, the principal is the same and it will work most of the time, but there are times when the bump key works far better.

I suppose it is a matter of priority, earn money or have fun as a hobby picker.

[yono]

cledry say,

Well put it this way, you are a locksmith, you work in Florida in the blazing sun. Your job that day is to open and make keys to 75 trailers, 2 locks per that are being shipped to Haiti the next day. The locks sit about 6 to seven feet off of the ground. You can bump the lock in perhaps 10 seconds to 30 seconds on average or you can try single pin picking over your head.

I don't know which you as a hobbyist would pick as you have all day to practice on a lock and it doesn't cost you money, but I know I do what it takes to get the job done in the fastest easiest manner.

No a snapper will not do the same as a bump key, the principal is the same and it will work most of the time, but there are times when the bump key works far better.

I suppose it is a matter of priority, earn money or have fun as a hobby picker.

i agree with you cledry, application of this all come to just one thing to open the lock, however, there is a big difference to a lot of us on how does it benefits best on what method to apply, be it lockpicking, bumpkeying, raking, snapping, or whatever. to open the lock. hobbyist lockpicker practice a lot and become profficient in lockpicking, and they were offended when the same lock they are picking for hours, can be bumpkey open by their younger brod or sis in seconds..most of us locksmiths, are straight practical guys.. we know what best method to apply in certain situations. so lets just keep on what we are best at..everyone?. regards

[gibson]

yono and cledry are right on. bumping is just another arrow in our quiver when faced with a lockout. sometimes a lock is so gunked up with graphite, compounded with an extra dose of wd-40 that you really can't get a feeling for when a pin is setting, or when time is an issue, or when it's freezing/sweltering out, etc. bump keys are just another option. i get a lot of satisfacton whenever i can accomplish an opening without having to resort to the drill. I get even more satisfaction when i can get a lock open by picking!

[Twisted T]

Okay well it looks as though I've P!$$3d a few people off with this question.
It wasn't my intent to do that!! I was wondering what was so special about
the B key. To some it would be best if it weren't discussed at all and to some
it's obviously a useful tool. I was reading a book last night by Bill Phillips
and he was stating that the key in question was leaked out to the public and the
media got hold of it and took it to the extreme. While it's true that I'm beginning my
trek into locksmithing I don't do this as a hobby. Other than my previous career that
ended years ago I can't recall another time in my life that I've been excited about learning and doing something. I've been doing my best not to ask to many questions
here because of concern of annoying the Old hands. I was once told that the only way to begin learning is to ask questions. However at another forum that I used to go to
it was frowned upon to ask and I was told very impolitely that asking isn't the way to learn. If that's true here then I'll be ever careful not to ask questions. And just set back and watch so to speak. Now having said that I now believe that it doesn't make any difference how you get the door open just get it open. So hopefully this will end the dispute over the B word.

[cledry]

Okay well it looks as though I've P!$$3d a few people off with this question.
It wasn't my intent to do that!! I was wondering what was so special about
the B key. To some it would be best if it weren't discussed at all and to some
it's obviously a useful tool. I was reading a book last night by Bill Phillips
and he was stating that the key in question was leaked out to the public and the
media got hold of it and took it to the extreme. While it's true that I'm beginning my
trek into locksmithing I don't do this as a hobby. Other than my previous career that
ended years ago I can't recall another time in my life that I've been excited about learning and doing something. I've been doing my best not to ask to many questions
here because of concern of annoying the Old hands. I was once told that the only way to begin learning is to ask questions. However at another forum that I used to go to
it was frowned upon to ask and I was told very impolitely that asking isn't the way to learn. If that's true here then I'll be ever careful not to ask questions. And just set back and watch so to speak. Now having said that I now believe that it doesn't make any difference how you get the door open just get it open. So hopefully this will end the dispute over the B word.

People have differing opinions, it doesn't mean that anyone is pissed off. I certainly can't imagine getting upset over comments on a forum, I think perhaps you are reading too much in the responses.

As a locksmith you understand that getting the job done efficiently is what pays the bills. I do try not to use bump keys when a customer is watching as I do feel it looks less than professional, but many times (such as the example I mentioned with the office trailers) there is nobody watching and the bump key is probably the most efficient way to do the job. Sometimes in the shop we will have a lock that doesn't yield quickly to picking, so a few bumps and it is done, job done, money collected on to the next job. Time is money.

[gibson]

i sincerely hope that you don't feel that my comments were in any way a criticism of you, i was just putting in my two cents on the thread. I am a firm believer in the old adage that the only bad question is the one that isn't asked, how else did any of us learn? just keep plugging away (pun intended). and if you get into the lockout business, in a very short time you'll have more than your share of war stories!

[Twisted T]

Just making sure that no one is upset over this post.
Mainly I was trying to understand what was so special about the
bump key. It just seemed to me that if it's using kinetic energy
to force the pins up to the shear line then why wouldn't a snap gun or other device
do the same thing? And when I agreed with Rai I was meaning that I wish the media
would lay off scaring the public. I suppose that I should have made that more clear.
I'm a firm believer in simplicity whereas if you have something that can do
the job quicker and simpler then by all means use it. Having said that it just seems
like that with those keys one would have to carry a wide variety to cover the many
locks out there. Maybe I'm mistaken but anyway I'm glad to be a part of this
community so long as you'll put up with all of my weirdness. So far I've learned a lot from people here and maybe I can in turn help someone some day.

[cledry]

Just making sure that no one is upset over this post.
Mainly I was trying to understand what was so special about the
bump key. It just seemed to me that if it's using kinetic energy
to force the pins up to the shear line then why wouldn't a snap gun or other device
do the same thing? And when I agreed with Rai I was meaning that I wish the media
would lay off scaring the public. I suppose that I should have made that more clear.
I'm a firm believer in simplicity whereas if you have something that can do
the job quicker and simpler then by all means use it. Having said that it just seems
like that with those keys one would have to carry a wide variety to cover the many
locks out there. Maybe I'm mistaken but anyway I'm glad to be a part of this
community so long as you'll put up with all of my weirdness. So far I've learned a lot from people here and maybe I can in turn help someone some day.

Locksmiths generally have to carry the key blanks anyway, so why not whip out a bump key. It just takes a few seconds.

[Twisted T]

Cledry now that makes sense I didn't think about making them on the spot
Duh!!! But now that you mention it I can see how you wouldn't have to carry all
of those different keys. Now do you store those for use at a later time or job?
BTW can you tell me where I can get blanks? No one here in my town will
sell me any maybe I should just look online?