I know there is a FAQ sticky on turning direction but it didn't really answer my question. Is there any indication that the lock gives telling you which way to turn? I read in the MIT roof and hacking guide that the correct direction would have a little give. If this is indeed true do some locks give false signs? I ask because while bored at work today I decided to give a lock a try. I didn't have my picks so I used what I had around (rigged bobby pin and screw driver) I set a few pins before realizing I was applying pressure in the wrong direction. With out having the key I wouldn't have known the direction to turn as this lock is on a vertically hinged door instead of horizontally hinged.
Sorry if i broke any rules with this post. I am fairly new to the forum.
No, locks arent going to give away a feel that youre picking them in the wrong direction, the only thing that will happen is that the plug will turn and the door will open, the plug will turn in the other direction and the door wont open, or in the case of some locks the plug cannot ever move in a particuar direction by design and thats just something we learn from experience, observation, and some rules about how doors work when they are inswing, outswing, right handed, left handed, etc.
You broke no forum posting rule by the way, but picking a lock at work does break the hobby lockpicker promise not to pick other peoples locks, locks that you dont exactly have rights to be picking, or locks you or someone may rely on to secure property or use for life safety, such as an emergency exit. Sometimes things can go wrong while picking, and it isnt much fun explaining to your boss, landlord, or campus police why a lock no longer works becausenyou were messing with it. The temptation is high to pick every lock you encounter, we've all been there, so we offer this advice as a cautionary tale, to hopefully save folks from making mistakes we made before we had anyone to give us a heads up or a warning that what we were doing was a bad idea or violated certain ethics.
A good idea is to buy some used locks and have a little collection to practice on, that way locks around work, school, or the apartment building dont seem so tempting. The other thing I havent mentioned is that while we are excited about this cool hobby, and you're excited about this new hobby, if someone at work gets wind that you are practicing it there, they may suddenly think you are sketchy. I have people at work who Ive known for 10 years and when they find out about hobby lockpicking, they just dont get it and for some reason when they tell others, they replace "he is into hobby lockpicking" with "he knows how to break into locks, be careful" Once that starts to happen it is really hard to get your reputation back.
I meant no harm in this post. There were no bad intentions behind this. I had the key to the lock in question and have full authority to be behind the lock. I just want to clear that up right away.
gbaby19 wrote:I meant no harm in this post. There were no bad intentions behind this. I had the key to the lock in question and have full authority to be behind the lock. I just want to clear that up right away.
I think you missed what I was trying to say. Nobody is accusing you of anything, but we have seen the arguement before that "this is a door to my apartment, I have the keys, its my lock, I can pick it if I want to." Ask yourself only one question: In being given these keys to my apartment/dorm room/office/workshop at work/cabinet/ , did the person who gave me the keys and the trust to have access to whats behind the door, imply or say, hey picking this door is ok too, or even taking the lock apart if you feel like it. Probably not, right? Im not trying to be preachy or scorn you, just sayin that having keys to a lock at work, doesnt usually include an ok from management to be picking the lock as well, that might be a little frowned upon.
Keep practicing, have fun, but be smart about it, no need to get in trouble, know what im sayin.. Squelchtone
I understand. I just didn't want anyone thinking I had any malicious intent. I see your point now. It wouldn't bode very well for me if I was caught picking these locks, especially in my line of work. I appreciate the advice and will definitely put it to use.
gbaby19 wrote:I meant no harm in this post. There were no bad intentions behind this. I had the key to the lock in question and have full authority to be behind the lock. I just want to clear that up right away.
Just remember not to pick any locks in use. It's just a general rule so you don't run into the trouble of ruining the springs inside the lock. It's happened to me before and I'm sure other pickers on here on the forum. This situation is one to avoid because you end up having to replace the lock at your cost.
Moving that aside, yes some locks do have a small give, but not all. Just remember that if you pick it a certain way, you may actually just lock the deadbolt/padlock back up, or you can be lucky and pick it (clockwise or counterclockwise) and have it open up for you.
Read about plug spinners! You might find these life savers useful.
Squelchtone wrote:No, locks arent going to give away a feel that youre picking them in the wrong direction, the only thing that will happen is that the plug will turn and the door will open, the plug will turn in the other direction and the door wont open, or in the case of some locks the plug cannot ever move in a particuar direction by design and thats just something we learn from experience, observation, and some rules about how doors work when they are inswing, outswing, right handed, left handed, etc.
Agreed, if there is not a mechanism or design preventing the lock from turning there is no way of knowing which way to apply torsion and plug spinners are somewhat helpful in cases like this. With locks that I have that have an internal design or mechanism that physically prevents them from turning CW or CCW I will lift all the pins up, apply torsion in either direction, take the pick away, release torsion and listen/feel for the pins to drop; I will then repeat for the other direction. Generally the direction that I am applying torsion in when I hear/feel pins fall is the direction to pick in.
@GBaby: With regard to what Squelchtone said about not picking locks in use, I can only agree and wish that I had found the Locksport code of ethics sooner, as it could have helped in avoided foolishly dropping master wafers and disabling a lock! Welcome to the forum, GBaby--I've learned a lot from the members of the forum and hope the same for you.
So this may be a dumb question but if a lock is picked in the wrong direction the plug will still spin you just wont get any end result?
EDIT:I just read the above post. So there will have to be a mechanism in place preventing it from turning in the wrong direction otherwise it will just spin?
gbaby19 wrote:So this may be a dumb question but if a lock is picked in the wrong direction the plug will still spin you just wont get any end result?
EDIT:I just read the above post. So there will have to be a mechanism in place preventing it from turning in the wrong direction otherwise it will just spin?
The easiest way to answer this question is that it would be the same as if you inserted the key and turned it in the "wrong" direction. Wrong in this case is meant to indicate the locked position. If you had a locked door (for example) and you turned the key in the "wrong" direction, you would generally just turn the plug forever or as far as it goes, either way it would not allow the cam to engage the bolt or latch to unlock the door. With picking though, there isn't a key to keep the pins in place. So if you turn the plug to 180 or 360 you will either "180 the lock" or reset it (the pin stacks fall back down and it would need to be picked again to turn the plug.) A way of turning the plug the other direction without having to repick the lock is to use a plug spinner that will spin the plug fast enough that it will pass the shear line and then you can continue to turn the plug in the other direction and unlock the door. My post about an internal mechanism preventing the plug from spinning refers to a pin or a housing design that prevents the plug (keyed or picked) from turning a certain direction. I see this mainly with ignitions, padlocks, and cabinet locks. In this case it is not possible to even turn the plug in one direction, and my instructions were a way of deciphering what direction that is. It will not work for locks that would allow a key to spin over 360 degrees in them (as Squelctone said.) Or to answer your questions more directly:
1. Yes, but I figured I'd outline my answer as above.
2. Yes. Please keep in mind that if you "180 the lock" you will have to correct that otherwise it will be stuck. More information below:
Sorry for such elementary questions. I've just always wanted to fully grasp concepts in which I'm interested. Also that video was quite helpful, thank you.
No need to apologize, it is important to understand the concepts. Proper understanding of the concepts will make practice much more effective. May the information on this site distill into knowledge and mature into wisdom !
gbaby19 wrote:Sorry for such elementary questions. I've just always wanted to fully grasp concepts in which I'm interested. Also that video was quite helpful, thank you.
Check out these lock picking lessons by Schuyler Towne, there are 24 of them. They will answer many of your general questions.
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