wired EDM, high tech method of making picks

by **machinist** » 13 Dec 2005 22:45

For all of you who haven't tried you don't know making a perfect "ball" or "snowman" is very tough to do even with dremel. I have access to a machine called an EDM, (eletric discharge machine) at work its capable of .00005" accuracy and can be computer programmed if one were so inclined, and I am. simultainiously I got my hands on some bandsaw blade about to be thrown out. I've been working on this project for a while now but I finally got the jig made to hold the blades while they are being cut. Its made out of aluminum and has a small .015X.080" step to hold the blade. If everything goes as planned I'm going to try and make a few picks this week. I'll report my findings back here.

bandsaw blade as comapared to hacksaw
[img=http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/8025/img13173nx.th.jpg]

blade holding jig

[img=http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/9443/img13227zo.th.jpg]

by **cha0s** » 13 Dec 2005 23:13

that will be really cool and im anxious to see how it turns out. i only see one problem. wont the bandsaw blade be flimsy and flexable? I would personally get feeler guage or stick to hacksaw blades. i admit ive never handled a bandsaw blade when its fully off a machine but i imagine its not too stiff. if you walk up to a bandsaw you can easily bend the blade around.. let me know how it works out ill see if i can snag some from my schools tech dept. if it works.

by **wraith** » 14 Dec 2005 1:39

That's pretty kewl. I'm asuming you can make some interesting shapes?

Think you could try using some wiper blades? If so, I have plenty.

Trey

by **machinist** » 16 Dec 2005 1:41

Techinically you can use ANY material that conducts electrisity in an edm but, I just have plenty of bandsaw blade, its .025" thick bandsaw blades naked (without paint) come to around .023". It tends to be a higher quality steel however, NOT HEAT TREATED which is going to be project #2 if this one works.

I'm going to take one more crack at the machine tomarrow before the weekend, I used a machine just like it before by the same manufacturer only it was an 2002 model this is an 1982 and is a bit more finicky to setup and cut. The programming is quite a bit more complex than what I'm used to and I work on this during break time.

Its negligable how flexible it is as compared to hacksaw blades, its the same quality of steel if not better and slightly thicker. If for some reason it doesn't work I'll just use some hacksaw blades.

so far it seems quite a bit of work per pick and only worth it for the most complex of shapes the good news is designing the shapes is easy just running the machine this machine in particular is time consuming. even if I don't make some picks I'm definately going to try my hardest to make a 7 pin and 8 pin tubular pick body with it.

by **Auto45** » 16 Dec 2005 8:31

machinist

Anxious to see how it turns out also, can you fill in your profile so we can know where you live. It helps use know what kind of locks and picks you are using,or working on.
thanks
auto

by **Shrub** » 16 Dec 2005 9:21

I dont think its worth the effort to make tubular picks with it but up to you.

What language does it use? is it 'g' codes by any chance?

by **machinist** » 16 Dec 2005 23:26

All CNCs I know of use G-code the problem is theres 8 dialects I've come across and at least 150 more out there. This machine uses an older very strange method of G-code. When I want to make a 1" long cut the # changes from 1 to 1000 and then it has its own special codes for preperations. Me and 3 coworkers tried for a few hours to get the thing going but no avail. The good news is my programming appears solid.

As far as the tubulars go what I estimated as follows: programming 10 minutes, the body is 30 minutes set-up time another 20 "cut time" where I go read a magazine or watch the machine go by itself, 30 minutes for a handle, and tension adjustment parts, another 30 EDM'ing the "pins" and 15 to finish the body.

About 2 1/2 hours assuming the EDM works. Its more about making one than obtaining one.

by **Shrub** » 17 Dec 2005 10:11

What make is the machine? Briggeport brought out a variation on the 'g' codes that are very simular but did have specific 'extra' commands.

There are a few differant cnc 'code' systems but without going getting my collage work i cant name them off the top of my head, ill try and sort you somthing out if interested.

by **Omikron** » 17 Dec 2005 14:42

machinist,

Have you been successful in making any picks with this machine yet? If so, I'd love to see some pictures of the process!

by **machinist** » 17 Dec 2005 19:55

its a 1992 brother wire EDM with no disk drive, almost all CNC's use their own specific kind of G-code, the trick is getting the right post processor (I program almost exclusively by CAM/CAD (computer aided manufacturing/computer aided design) and the geometry is converted in tools movements and wirtten in G-code ofcourse and the post processor would convert it into the right "dialect" of the machine) I appreciate the help but I used a couple of conversion programs and my program is solid however, the machine is being very finicky as far as doing any work. I've watched a 2D graphic of my snowman pick being made on the machines screen but, I'm getting 2-3 machine function errors when I actually start to cut anything, ranging from coolant to short circuits. I'm used to using newer EDMS where 10 years later they worked out all the bugs and gave the machine self-correcting intelligence.

http://www.brother-usa.com/machinetool/ ... a_ove.html

the machine I was taught on^

I'll post some pics of the machine if I get a chance and some pics of the actaul picks if they cut anytime soon, if the machine functions I'll be coming in next saturday on my own time and do some more cutting.

The on good thing about the EDM being a pain is while a coworker was trying to get the machine going for his projects I found the time to machine plastic block for my tomahawk clone but, thats another topic. I love being a machinist.

by **machinist** » 17 Dec 2005 19:58

Also forgot, if the machine works for picks I think I can get it to make some bump keys out of blanks and some bumpkeys made out of high carbon tool steel.

by **Shrub** » 17 Dec 2005 20:32

I wasnt doubting your abilties i was merely interested, i was taught full programming, you sit and write the program, useing cad to convert the movement files came later and is cheating but a very welcome one.

I have a boxford cnc and a bridgeport cnc at the moment along with normal machines but to be honest i rearely use them now, most of my work is prototyping, the cncs are good for repeat work which ive never realy done at home.

I used to love being a machinest but much prefer working for myself as a lockie :wink:

by **Omikron** » 18 Dec 2005 0:46

Speaking of prototyping...

You should have heard the reaming a fellow student got at the lab when someone thought it was a good idea to rapid-prototype a few flat washers... :shock:

by **raimundo** » 18 Dec 2005 14:50

www.fab.cba.mit.edu

by **raimundo** » 18 Dec 2005 14:57

MIT has a Fablab (fabrication lab) that has been recommended to me as a place that has tools to help people around the world with creating anything fabricated, I was just trying to get a discussion of that going here on the theory that there are people here who know more about it than I. I was told that it was a good source for knowlege and methods to create micro mechanical tools, when I consider the medeco lock or some of the springless laser trak type locks, it always comes to me that lockpicks as we know them are low tech and fairly obvious tools, but a tool that could reach in under the pins and manipulate them up, down and twist them and feed back information about sticking points would be the future. I hope some of the better web searchers out there continue this discussion.

wired EDM, high tech method of making picks

wired EDM, high tech method of making picks

Mit fab lab, google it.

sorry, that link is somehow wrong.

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