Newbie tubular questions

[Shermanator]

Hey all,

Okay so I just got a Southord 7 pin tubular pick. The instructions say to slide the pins up and down for 30 minutes to loosen them. Anyways how loose do they need to be? For example if I unscrew the screw and expose 1 pin and rest the weight of the pick on that pin, should the pin be loose enough for the pick to be able to slide down. Does that sentence make sense?? lol neways only a couple of the pins are loose enough to do that at the moment. Multi Purpose Light Oil at the ready

Cheers chaps

[Shermanator]

Ps why are there 2 rubber O rings??

[Nasydave]

The o-rings are what presses against the feelers when you apply tension via tightening the collar. One wasn't quite enough, if you tightened real tight, you were putting metal on metal.

Without the collar tightened, you should be able to "flick" the feelers back and forth with your fingertip. (IMHO) Not quite where they will move if you tilt the tool, but moving all 7 by moving the "washer" on the end should need no effort at all. This may require some emery cloth sanding on the feelers and the channels they ride in.

[Shermanator]

Okay cheers, thats the TPXA-7 right?
Just thought I'd say im new to picking tubular locks. Think I'll go and buy a bike lock or something to practice on, any tips?
Think my pick needs a bit of emeryfying

[Nasydave]

As far as practice locks, it's discouraging. If you go to the hardware store and buy a cheap practice lock, you learn how to pick it in 30 seconds, and you never learn anything more. I bought a couple ACE II's on ebay for $5-6 bucks apiece, and still have problems with a couple of them. I keep meaning to keep a log of feeler movement vs. spring tension and pin size, but haven't had the time lately.

You can get the cheap practice locks (or ACE IIs) on EBAY for $5 apiece. If you pick a seller that has both, you can get a couple and only pay shipping one time. Do a search on vending locks.

There's a ebay store called workmans that I've had good dealing with.

[LockNewbie21]

Sand that bugger!! two? mine came with three i didnt even know till i took it apart, all except to pin pushers(myown word for them) would work i sanded, debured, rubed with silicon lube, and out came three o rings! DUmb thing i hate it i have to have one small one in there for them all to move


Andy

[Shermanator]

I didnt understand any of that lol they put 3 O rings in by accident??

Thanks for your tips guys, very helpful indeed. This forum is excellent!
Anyways, okay so how do you emery the tracks that the pins run in? And do I want to make the pins as even as possible? Do you ever need to use very low tension on any tubular locks?
I couldnt find any tubular bike locks - might have to resort to ebay....
Oh yeah and whats the difference between normal tubulars and ACE II's?
Are normal ones found on cheap bike locks and are ACE II's in higher security places like vending machines? [talking UK here]. Surely there cant be just one make of good locks?

And off topic slightly- whats the difference between deadbolts and normal pin tumbler locks? I have been able to pick all the locks I've tryed except my front and back doors, the pins are much taller than say padlocks, are they deadbolts?

Much appreciated

[LockNewbie21]

Okay first question,

Take your pick completely apart all the picks and the tensioner, then use a small allen wrench to remove the holder. Okay now take a fine grit emory paper, spray with silicon lube or wd40(the paper) and sand away, don't go over board. You can sand the feelers. once done sanding take a brush and brush away the sanding stuff, then take a paper towel spray with lube and whip it clean and smooth, then asseble it and it should work.


Quesiton 2. Deadbolts- there also pin tumblers are pad locks are, but the term dead bolt means theres a retracting bolt once the key is turned that reciedes into the lock thats where the term comes from, the pins are bigger than padlocks, but the picking theory doesn't change, also if you new to picking do not pick you locks you rely on even if you are skilled. If deadbolts your not good at search for Lockboards you can buy some deadbolts off ebay get a bunch and practice on them mounted to your board.


As far as cheap tubular locks, don't by a bike lock you pay mostly for the not the lock but the actual material. go to ebay type in vending lock and tubulars pop up everywhere.


Andy

[Nasydave]

For sanding the channels I wrap the emery cloth around a matchbook end - it's just about the perfect size. You're not really sanding to change anything, more to remove any small burrs, etc in the metal. My feelers are no longer blue....

The ace IIs are more difficult, as they use different springs behind different pins. They have ACE II on the center post. I'm not sure how common they are in the UK.

There are some really cheap locks that require just a little bit of tension.

I've tried three orings, and didn't like the result, as it was too difficult to get the really hard tension needed for ACE II. One was not enough, because you ended up with metal on metal. I stick with 2. If you're ver at a HW store, look at their selection. I actually have one oring that's just a little larger than the other, since the first one in will be compressed to a smaller size, and the 2nd one (larger) in will fill the remainder of the space.

[assweasel]

The South Ord 7 pin pick really sucks. I suggest you get yourself a mighty mini from Gunroom.com. That is the best 7 pin pick ever built and trust me I have owned them all and used them all. For ten years I worked as a locksmith for Greys (Coca Cola) And during that time we only used Ace and Ace II locks. In my final year we were switching to the 9 pin National lock but only as replacements for worn or damaged locks.

It is a bit high priced but well worth the money if you need to use this type of pick regularly.

[LockNewbie21]

Yea i heard the mighty mini is great, just a little tricky with the allen tighten screws but looks like a solid pick if you ask me. But iw ould say like most that if you going to become a lockie or other security job that the peterson with attachments is hands down the best, I will say the SO 7 pins picks like the one i have is not the best with its week shaft but a littel sanding and silicon lube its works fine, and is comfy fo single pin picking ace 2's.. but i only have one to practice on so i can't speak for the majority, if i do get a good lockie job i will opt for the peterson though even though i see few tubulars in use excpat at walmart on the cases and occasionally a few diffrent places, but yo never know whne you will get a call for one.


Andy

[franko452000]

OK.. theres more information in how then 2 years ago when i was asking about the tubular lock. i found some of the harder locks, 8-pins, off-set left and right. books on the subject may be hard too fine.... gotta digg a little. i re-pin these locks like you may re-pin a pin-tumbler lock. . does anyone know about the ( dead-pin ). talk to me!.... i do

[keysman]

Ok, I will bite , tell me about the dead pin.


By the way I use a CSP ( Custom Security Products) Pick, I believe they went out of business some years back, It is very well made, and comes with a variety of "tips " for 7, 8 , 9 and 10 pin (VAN) + something called "Pin in Pin" , I have never seen the PIP lock , I am not sure of its use.

I have purchased a few CSP picks from smiths who just couldn’t get them to work or didn’t know what they were.

There is defiantly a technique to using this pick , once mastered ( 10 minutes) will pretty much open most “ace “ type locks.. I have a few ACE II ,that I just finally gave up on and drilled them, but generally I have great luck with this particular pick.

I bought a LEE pick for a friend from Hawley ( ?) witch also worked very well.. I am still trying to convince my friend to trade for 1 of my CSP picks .. he is not going for it.

I have heard the Peterson pick works very well .. if I ever get the chance I will try one out, but that has to be the ugliest pick I have ever seen.

[Shrub]

An average time for an ace or ace 2 lock with my SO is around a minute or less i think,

[assweasel]

Give me a CSP Pick master and an ace and I defy anyone to open it as fast with a key. It is not as fast as a key but trust me on plain ACE gem forts etc you would be hard pressed to see the difference. I am not talking about some ACE I am talking all ACE.

ACE 2 is well under 3 minutes depending on the sequence. More likely under a minute but the sequence can sometimes be a beatch.