some people have no scruples, bump keys on ebay

[lockey1963]

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/DEPTH-KEYS-AND-BU ... dZViewItem

lets hope it comes back to haunt them.

[mickramsey]

snap same set as this one
http://www.justlocks.org/tools_supplied.htm

selling to locksmiths is ok but not to anyone on ebay!

[ponsaloti]

selling bump keys on e-bay, or on this site, is there a differance?

[JackNco]

Nope and personally i don't have a problem with people selling them. then again i do have lever locks on both doors...

But still most criminals will use a brick or a pry bar anyway

[jason]

I remember the first time I bought a set of bump keys - many, many years ago - (sold to me as being able to open any "Union" lock) - no instructions and pillock that I was (am) thought you just put them in and turned.

Find that raking followed by single pin picking is just more reliable and impresses the customer loads into the bargain!

[linty]

i don't see anything especially wrong with this, one way or another people will get their hands on these keys, at least if it's happening on ebay in the public eyes it gives us an idea of the scope of this problem.

[Eyes_Only]

But as a people who are supporting locksports as a legitimate law abiding activity, I think we should take Mark Tobias's stand on this issue and discourage the sale of bump keys period, otherwise we'll be providing support to the rants of individuals like Bo Deitl

And like Linty said, people are gonna get their hands on bump key one way or another, whether we help supply them to the public or not because the information and instructions on how to make and use them is out.

Hopefully the public in the US will soon all sport higher security locks in the near future and put this issue to rest.

[JackNco]

unfortunately being a bit of a problem is not enough as most people wont hear about it. taking them out of production would just mean less people hear about them and so don't bother getting better locks. but you can still spend 10 minutes making them.

All the best

[Eyes_Only]

Good point, bump keys may serve a good purpose for the meantime. Still I don't think it's a good idea if people from this forum or any locksport groups willing sells them to just anyone who wants one. Sharing the information about it is another matter though.

[DrStu]

I only have two bump keys and I made both by hand using files. Preventing sales of bump keys will not prevent a determined person from obtaining them. Lock picks are only suppose to be sold to Locksmiths, but I have never had any Internet site ask me to provide proof of this. A good Lock Pick set is much more versatile and effective at compromising locks. I believe that you cannot be for possessing Lock Picks and against obtaining Bump Keys. I my opinion Bump Keys are just a ballistic form of Raking with traditional picks and no different than using a Pick Gun.

[JackNco]

i disagree. pick guns are expensive in comparison and require more skill than a bump key. and EPGs are way more expensive although easier to use. or thats what ive been told.

[jason]

My manual pick gun (Majestic) was good but I preferred to use my HPC electric when on difficult calls. Bump keys are just another tool to use but they lack a certain finesse to the customer who is paying you.

I'm not in favour of pick guns (whether manual or electric) going to non-lockies, same goes with bump keys and mica.

If you're picking for fun rather than for a job - why do you need them?

[zeke79]

That is like saying why do you need a corvette when all you do is drive to work. It's all about the fun of all aspects of the hobby and locks in general.

[jason]

I would disagree with that analogy - I use bump keys, mica, letterbox kit etc., not for the joy of opening locks without keys, but when I have to get in quickly in situations such as warrant executions. This is not the preserve of "sport lockpicking".

I don't believe any locksmith would have objections to hobby pickers knowing how mica, bump keys and similar bypasses work, if only to help them make their properties more secure, but there is a whole world of difference between knowing how a tool works and actually buying it with the reason that you enjoy finding out about locks, most bypasses really aren't that exciting, to do or watch.

I prefer to pick locks open when I'm doing domestic and commercial lockout work but I also reserve the option to use other bypass techniques when circumstances make them necessary.

To go back to your analogy, why not use a formula 1 racing car for your commute rather than a corvette? It's a lot faster, will handle a lot better and as most commuters travel alone the fact that it can only hold a single passenger isn't a disadvantage (although the prohibitive purchase costs, the need for a trained pit crew, fuel requirements, poor low speed tractability, peaky engines, specialised and frequent maintenance requirements - necessary after each outing, cramped surroundings and other little inconveniences such as having to remove the steering wheel to get in and out of the cockpit may discourage most people) - my point is that it is really not necessary to buy specialised kit for routine use. By all means use specialised kit (e.g. a corvette in your example) if you really have to but you'll never be able to use it properly unless you go on a track day.

This then opens up a whole new can of worms in that you could then argue that the advanced sections of this site should be accessible to all - then next thing we know is that this site gets negative publicity because of the information on bypasses becomes available.

Please don't consider this a personal attack, but my feelings are that hobby pickers don't have a legitimate need to own bypass tools - there are some who feel that lockpicks shouldn't be as easily available as they are - but that is how some of us got started.

[Eyes_Only]

I agree with jason. The way I see it, most "by-pass" tools are designed to help open doors when picking doesn't work or isn't practical. We are hobby pickers, we have no need to know how to open doors.