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Skeleton Key

Having read the FAQ's you are still unfulfilled and seek more enlightenment, so post your general lock picking questions here.
Forum rules
Do not post safe related questions in this sub forum! Post them in This Old Safe

The sub forum you are currently in is for asking Beginner Hobby Lock Picking questions only.

Skeleton Key

Postby Tygart » 11 Feb 2007 1:10

I have a Skeleton Key, the numbers on it are 92 on the key, I45 on the handle, and BT 1/2 on the other side of the handle..

What do these number mean???
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Postby SFGOON » 11 Feb 2007 2:02

Got pics? :wink:
"Reverse the obvious and the truth will present itself." - Carl Jung
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Postby Tygart » 11 Feb 2007 2:07

Ill get them up tomorrow.
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Postby JackNco » 11 Feb 2007 12:36

This may be a very stupid question but wht type of lock is it for, ive herd people refer to Skeleton Keys when referring to old Lever picks and Warded picks.
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Postby Shrub » 11 Feb 2007 12:42

A skeleton key is a pick, its used on old warded lever locks,

The name comes from the fact that a normal working key only needs to have all the wardings cut off it to leave the part that throws the bolt and it would then work in all the locks of that type/size/style etc,

I think the op is incorrectly refering to a mortice key,

Are the numbers stamped on the key? if so there is no way of us nowing what they mean unless its a common key for a common lock such as a mail box,

Are the numbers part of the key? moulded as part of the key when it was made? if so they are the key blank code and either all the numbers are for that or some of them are to say its a master key or its for a certain type of lock etc,

A picture of the key might help but to be honest unless its a regular key thats supplied cut for somthign that is all across the town/city/state/country then the numbers wont mean anything to us the same as you, otherwise its the blank id numbers,
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Postby Keyring » 11 Feb 2007 12:54

It's quite amusing really. I agree with Shrub that a skeleton key is one which has been cut down to the 'bare bones' to allow it to operate a range of warded locks. Americans in particular seem to like calling keys with a certain shape, skeleton keys.

However I have also heard americans, with some justification, wondering why in the UK we call a bit key by the name mortice key. They wonder what the key has to do with the way the lock is mounted in a hole in the door (mortice). It obviously arises because most mortice locks in the uk are operated using a key of that shape, but there are mortice locks with euro-profile cylinders fitted, and they are not operated by 'mortice keys'.

I think history has a lot to answer for.
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Postby JackNco » 11 Feb 2007 13:19

Shrub wrote:A skeleton key is a pick, its used on old warded lever locks,

The name comes from the fact that a normal working key only needs to have all the wardings cut off it to leave the part that throws the bolt and it would then work in all the locks of that type/size/style etc,


Yep ive got one i filed down for an old "Willehall locks" padlock i have. just wanted it as part of my collection to show people how bad they really are.
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Postby Shrub » 11 Feb 2007 20:44

The simple answer from me is that i dont know im afraid,

Im guessing its for a furniture lock or maybe a table safe sort of thing, somthing not modern but how old i dont know,

The key works a lever lock with the numbers maybe being the model of cash box or furniture lock etc,

Sorry but i will have to pass on this to someone more knowledgable,
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Postby Tygart » 11 Feb 2007 21:34

Thank you Shrub, yah furniture lock was what I was guessing.

I picked it up at a yard sale a few years back for 2 dollers, they had a bunch of them plus some door keys but I did not want to spend that much, at the time I just wanted something cool for my key ring.


Thanks
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Postby Gordon Airporte » 11 Feb 2007 23:07

I just picked up a lever lock myself and I want to make sure I understand these - that lock would have three levers, and either the deepest cut at the center or the two outermost cuts would throw the bolt?
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Postby illusion » 12 Feb 2007 7:50

Gordon Airporte wrote:I just picked up a lever lock myself and I want to make sure I understand these - that lock would have three levers, and either the deepest cut at the center or the two outermost cuts would throw the bolt?


Yes, and looking at the thickness of the cuts nearest the edges, I would guess that they throw the bolt; oh, and the fact they appear to be uncut is a big indicator in a lot of cases..

Yeah, it seemed to be a 3 lever lock that is designed to be used on both sides of the door. I can't help but find this odd, because it would have to be a big piece of furniture to allow you to lock it from the inside, and if it was a safe, then why would you need to lock from the inside and why isn't there a more complex key if it *is* a walk-in safe?

Perhaps a key for a gate, a shed or... a... door?
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Postby Tygart » 12 Feb 2007 16:47

The key looks too large for a door!
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Postby Gordon Airporte » 13 Feb 2007 0:48

The interior doors of my house - built some time in the 30's I believe - have simple lever locks. The 2 lever mortise lock I just picked up from Lowes for $7 looks to be a replacement for this sort of thing. My guess is that the key was for an interior door, where you don't need the same pick-resistance as an exterior door.
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Postby Mutzy » 13 Feb 2007 6:32

there are alot of lever type mortice locks that take keys like that. Usually, they can be used from both sides, which half explains the symmetry of the key.

For the point of the exercise, i'll use this picture for reference. And the locks that i'm talking about look like this lock.

The left hand highest cut is the bolt throw. The next three steps beside it are the three cuts that operates the levers. When the key is inserted from the other side, the right hand highest cut operates the bolt throw, with the three cuts to the left of it operating the levers.

When the key is inserted, only one half of the key is actually used to retract the bolt mechanism. You don't see these type of locks on new houses these days, since other more secure locks, i.e. knobset / deadbolt configurations or deadlatching mortice locks are much more reliable and easily rekeyable.

And on that note, these locks arn't rekeyable. There are some types of mortice locks that only have wardings that stop other keys from entering the lock. As such, in a particular lock series, they may have 40 different lock warding combinations. Which means that if you have a lock that takes key #27, and someone else has a lock that takes key #27, his key will work your lock. To stop a key from working the lock requires replacement. Like I said, they're being replaced by more secure locks.

At work, if we have to secure a door with one of these locks on it, we usually install a conventional deadbolt on the door and remove the mortice lock's locking bolt.

My thoughts are that the 92 is the key/lock number.

/deposits my $.02c in the LP101 piggy bank.
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