Hi. I'm curious about mushroom pins.

[Nox]

Specifically, I'd like to know

1) which Shlage Models have them?

2)I know that you have to use a technique called "reverse picking" (dubbed by Eddie the Wire). But, can they be picked with a snap-gun in some way?

I'm sorry for any of the typos you may find, and any of the wronge terminology.

I'm new to this, so please have patience.

[cjames73]

1)i'm not sure which shlage models have mushroom pins but using the search button will find you some answers.

2)you can use normal picking techniques for getting past security pins as well as reverse picking.
a snap gun will also get past them.
again, try the search button.

try these links too, theres a lot of info you will find helpful
viewtopic.php?t=10715
viewtopic.php?t=10528

[Gordon Airporte]

It's a technical difference, but Schlages are likely to have spool pins but not mushroom pins. That's from-the-factory Schlages, not just any lock with a Schlage keyway.
Reverse picking is not a convenient way to pick all of the pin in a lock, but it may sometimes be necessary to get past a particular stack with a security pin in it. Usually you pick to a false set, then go back and take care of the security pins - as cjames said, there's masses of info if you search: try 'spool' and 'false set'.

[fizzmahon]

are mushroom pins much harder to pick than spool pins? i picked an abus discus but im not sure if it had spools or mushrooms.

[mercurial]

are mushroom pins much harder to pick than spool pins? i picked an abus discus but im not sure if it had spools or mushrooms.

From memory, the true Abus Discus(ie not other-branded copies) contains mushrooms as opposed to spools.

It is impossible to make an absolute statement as to whether spool pins are harder than mushroom pins (or vice-versa) - the exact shape of the spool/mushroom pins in question, and the tolerances of the lock in which they are installed are going to be far more significant factors.

For the OP - spool pins and mushroom pins respond & pick in a very similar way to eachother, and plenty of information regarding that can be found here, by searching for 'security pins'.

As said above, if you find security pins in a factory-pinned Schlage lock, they are going to be spool, not mushroom pins. You will find that they both provide very similar feedback whilst picking anyway.

Reverse-picking is a way to tackle security pins, briefly it involves raising all pins as far as possible, applying strong tension to bind them, and gently scrubbing the pins whilst reducing the tension. The theory behind this is that the security top-pins will be above the shear-line to begin with, and are hence unable to interfere with the picking process.

Mastering reverse-picking is best left until you have already mastered SPP of locks with standard non-security pins, followed by picking locks with security pins (spool, mushroom and serrated), by more conventional means.

Very precise control of tension is required to reverse-pick all but the most sloppy locks, it is best left alone for now.

...Mark

[blackfoot]

feather touch tension wrench helps alot with mushroom and spool pins ...........................pick gun helps to when you get fustrated with picking it.

[Eyes_Only]

Most all new Schlage locks you can buy at hardware stores have spool pins from what I remember from my last trip to Lowes.

[Stash]

feather touch tension wrench helps alot with mushroom and spool pins

Very true, I find that the weight of a finger is sufficient when picking security pins and that any more will cause you to get the false set. Also, you have to let up the slightest bit on the tension as you pick the security pins or they'll get stuck in my experience.
~Stash

[PrimalFuture]

I purchased a Schlage deadbolt from Home Depot not too long ago. Took it apart and from what I can see, it DOES have mushroom security pins, in addition to 2 spools. The mushrooms can be seen on the number 2 and 5 pins in the photo of my Schlage below.

[PrimalFuture]

p.s. The model number of my Schlage with the 2 mushrooms and 2 spools reads B360N V 609.

[mercurial]

I purchased a Schlage deadbolt from Home Depot not too long ago. Took it apart and from what I can see, it DOES have mushroom security pins, in addition to 2 spools. The mushrooms can be seen on the number 2 and 5 pins in the photo of my Schlage below.

I stand corrected, as far as my assertion regarding factory-pinned Schage's containing spools as opposed to mushrooms.

For those talking about the feather-touch tension wrench - there are typically mixed feelings expressed in discussions about themhere.

Some people claim they really help them to tackle security pins, many others (myself included) claim they lose a great deal of the important feedback you would get through a conventional tension wrench.

How many of the people who reccommend a feather-touch wrench as a useful aid to picking security-pins are providing this advice, meaning well, but solely based upon reading the sales-pitch for these tools online, as opposed to hands on experience with the tool?

For those who have had postive(or negative) results of their own hands-on experience with a feather-touch wrench, to tackle security pins - could you specify which feather-touch wrench you are using, and on what keyways? Do you find that the flexibility of the wrench means you lose any feedback you would normally get from a more conventional wrench?

Also, I have seen it said many times that a lot of commercially produced feather-touch tension wrenches are so large that they leave little if no room in the keyway for the pick, if in fact the wrench fits into the keyway in at all!

My experience has always been that feather-light tension applied with a simple conventional tnesion wrench(and good tension control) is what is generally important when single-pin picking security pins. For this I certainly prefer using a more conventional wrench (simple 90degree bend, petersen flat-style, or twist-flex - almost homemade).

The twist-flex is often a great compromise between a feather-touch wrench & a simple wrench. A feather-touch wrench, I feel (if it fits at all) loses too much feedback when picking I think the flexibility is dampening it.

Whereas, a conventional rigid wrench (which is less forgiving, requiring more precise control of tension) provides the feedback that helps to find and deal with the security pins - and this my usual tool of choice...

People's picking style, and own experiences will differ, but I feel the two viewpoints presented above give a good idea as to the thoughts here about feather-touch wrenches - some of the pros and cons.

...Mark

[mercurial]

Sorry for the double post.

For this I certainly prefer using a more conventional wrench (simple 90degree bend, petersen flat-style, or twist-flex - almost homemade).

Should read

"... - almost all homemade"

I do check over my posts before submitting them, if I've hit double-posting territory, I best be off to bed.

I should also have mentioned, that I know people who even go so far as to say that the twist-flex style wrenches take away/absorb too much feedback from the lock.

...Mark

[Eyes_Only]

A short ridged tension wrench is my preference as well when dealing with security pins. You diffenately get more feed back and feel with a ridged wrench.

[hippy5749]

Eyes_only,

Did you mean to spell rigid, as in stiff. Or did you mean ridged, as in has bumps on it? Just wanting some clarification, no harm meant

Thanks,
hippy5749

[mercurial]

feather touch tension wrench helps alot with mushroom and spool pins

Very true, I find that the weight of a finger is sufficient when picking security pins and that any more will cause you to get the false set. Also, you have to let up the slightest bit on the tension as you pick the security pins or they'll get stuck in my experience.
~Stash

Use of terminology is confusing the issue (for me at least) a little here I think.

A feather-touch tension wrench refers specifically to a tool designed to facilitate/limit the application of very light tension (and supposedly help in the picking of security pins) - as depicted here : http://www.lockpickshop.com/p-A-2.html

It seems that using feather-light tension on a conventional/'normal' (more rigid) tension wrench might be getting confused with the feather-touch wrench.

Stash - are you referring to using feather light tension - with a 'normal' wrench - or to using this 'feather-touch' tension tool? Or both?

The reason I ask, is twofold : I've read opinions regarding the feather-touch tension wrench linked to above, claiming it reduces/dampens feedback due to the spring, and it is often said to be far too large to function effectively in even relatively open keyways.

I can certainly say, from firsthand experience, that I believe the feather-touch wrenches DO dampen a great deal of the feedback one would expect whilst picking, when compared to a simple traditional tension wrench. I guess a some of this is purely a matter of personal preference though.

My personal experience is that the simple conventional wrenches, used with feather-light tension, provide the best balance between feedback and control of tension - but they require both experience and practice, when it comes to security pins.

...Mark