I scored an Apprenticeship :)

by **tommy15** » 27 Feb 2007 8:59

After much searching, iv finally got a start in a few days. In Australia, apprentices have to have a 3 months trial.

I got offered this position yesterday. Very excited. This company is long established, his based in inner city Sydney, has alot of vans on the road, and most of the clientel is mostlu corporate.

The only downside is that the boss sounds quite traditional in terms of how an apprentice should be taught. He said i wont be out on the road until my 3rd year. Then again im in it too learn everything i can and i think this company can provide very high quality training, iv got my whole life to get on the road. I love the inner city atmosphere too.

As is always the case with me, its feast of famine. After all this time with no positive leads, i have been offered another 2 positions today. One of them isnt really for me, but the other ...

This company is small, only 2 vans on the road. Also, thier main jobs are government housing. Not a negative because i care about dealing with lunatics all day, moreso i figure what i will learn and be exposed to is probly more limited. Upside of this company is that he likes to get apprentices out onto the road asap, within months. I love this part of it.

So decisions decisions. Could i be offered some advice on this please ?

by **UWSDWF** » 27 Feb 2007 9:42

i'd go for the first of the two ...

the second guy sounds like he uses apprentices as cannon fodder at the gov. housing complex....

by **Shrub** » 27 Feb 2007 13:46

I missed the swap between the two job offers but go for the one that keeps you in the shop for 3 years before goign out, that will be the best type of training you could ever wish for,

The one i say go for will very likely get you respected and give you the name of locksmith,

The other job offer will make you a fly by night door opener without the background skills to sort a problem out or offer alternitive,

Your quality of work will be spot on with the lengthy one at the end of the day where i summise the quick and easy one will get you by but youll never be an expert on anything and quality will not be there in your work,

Sounds like the quick and easy one is a way for the owner to get cheap labour and maybe also claim off the goverment for trainign you up,

But its your choice at the end of the day,

by **fsdhy** » 27 Feb 2007 13:59

tommy15 wrote:After much searching, iv finally got a start in a few days. In Australia, apprentices have to have a 3 months trial.

I got offered this position yesterday. Very excited. This company is long established, his based in inner city Sydney, has alot of vans on the road, and most of the clientel is mostlu corporate.

The only downside is that the boss sounds quite traditional in terms of how an apprentice should be taught. He said i wont be out on the road until my 3rd year. Then again im in it too learn everything i can and i think this company can provide very high quality training, iv got my whole life to get on the road. I love the inner city atmosphere too.

As is always the case with me, its feast of famine. After all this time with no positive leads, i have been offered another 2 positions today. One of them isnt really for me, but the other ...

This company is small, only 2 vans on the road. Also, thier main jobs are government housing. Not a negative because i care about dealing with lunatics all day, moreso i figure what i will learn and be exposed to is probly more limited. Upside of this company is that he likes to get apprentices out onto the road asap, within months. I love this part of it.

So decisions decisions. Could i be offered some advice on this please ?

Take the first one. HOWEVER, mention that you'd appreciate it if you could ride along with some of the other lockies once in a while, just as a change of pace.

by **Shrub** » 27 Feb 2007 14:02

To be honest the ideal is to ask to accompany them on your days off thaty way you get your ful training and go out on the road you also have the benifit of a brown nose :wink:

by **NickBristol** » 27 Feb 2007 14:21

The mention of not getting out on the road for 3years might be a little test of your commitment from the owner... if you'd reacted by telling him to stick his job somewhere - and sideways too - like a lot of brats would have said then you might not have been in such an excellent position now. Don't be surprised if you get a few little tasters here and there of shadowing experienced guys. Don't be afraid to ask for it but don't whine about not going and don't pester every second!

You've nailed a great opportunity there so take advantage of it to the full. Oh and keep a sense of humour no matter what crap you have to do or how hard you're finding it.

by **Eyes_Only** » 27 Feb 2007 14:57

I agree, the first offer seems like a better choice. I don't know how the locksmith industry is different from other industries but I always hear working for a larger company is better for anyone first starting up in any trade. This has been true for me in the automotive trade. Plus, larger companies often times offer health benefits and other goodies you can qualify for in the future.

by **HeadHunterCEO** » 27 Feb 2007 19:10

Get on the road as soon as possible.
If you lurk this site and have read all the stickies than you already know enough about the basics.

by **tommy15** » 28 Feb 2007 6:59

Thanks very much everyone. Yep iv decided to go with the bigger company so im starting tomorrow morning. I agree get my more comprehensive training and when iv earned some trust see if i can take a ride every now and again aswell

Cheers
Tommy

by **fsdhy** » 28 Feb 2007 11:37

HeadHunterCEO wrote:Get on the road as soon as possible.
If you lurk this site and have read all the stickies than you already know enough about the basics.

Not true at all. Worst advice I've ever heard.

This site has info on all the fun stuff, but not much info on things a locksmith encounters day to day. Blank identification, most common lock malfunctions, installation, door closers, electronic access control, automative, commercial doors, master key systems, etc etc the list goes on and on.

FYI, there's a big difference between picking a lock thats in your hand/on your bench than picking a lock in negative 20 degree weather with an audience.

You don't know the job just because you read about it on the internet, sorry.

by **lockdr** » 28 Feb 2007 16:35

The advice given by fsdhy is very true. Much of a Locksmiths daily work involves mundane things like installing doorknobs, repairing door closers (the hydraulic ones are messy, BTW) and a lot of routine "Mr Fixit" work. The fun stuff comes as a welcome break from the daily drudgery. Stick with the large place that offers the in-house training rather than just going out in a van all the time and in a couple of years you will be a better all round Lockie and probably more knowledgeable than the guy who offered you the van job.

by **HeadHunterCEO** » 28 Feb 2007 20:05

fsdhy wrote:
HeadHunterCEO wrote:Get on the road as soon as possible.
If you lurk this site and have read all the stickies than you already know enough about the basics.

Not true at all. Worst advice I've ever heard.

This site has info on all the fun stuff, but not much info on things a locksmith encounters day to day. Blank identification, most common lock malfunctions, installation, door closers, electronic access control, automative, commercial doors, master key systems, etc etc the list goes on and on.

FYI, there's a big difference between picking a lock thats in your hand/on your bench than picking a lock in negative 20 degree weather with an audience.

You don't know the job just because you read about it on the internet, sorry.

Really, why don't you tell me all about whats its like to be an actual locksmith. i would like to hear more about "commercial doors" for example
.

by **tommy15** » 1 Mar 2007 7:28

Well had a big introduction today. Worked 9 hours, then did a few hours at college in the evening aswell which i have to do 2 nights a week as part of my training.

They are very busy i didnt stop (or anyone else) all day. Tomorrow im getting a crash course in master keying to prepare me for a big job i have to help with on Monday.

These guys have a large range of machinery both electric and mechanical. They have people specializing in specific fields as well, such as safes, cctv, ect. Yeh im going to learn a great deal here i made the right choice, thanks to the advice in this thread aswell.

by **Ermis** » 2 Mar 2007 21:10

I would take the second job with the smaller shop without thinking. The first job they will keep you in the shop for three years messuring old pins from re-keyed cylinders to refill the pinning kits. Answering phones and dealing with customers on the phone for call backs, or angry / unhappy customers. You will be cutting keys by the thousands but the majority of the keys will be the standards and in bulk for the guys on the road. You will not gain very much experience in the three years other then learning a hand full of key blanks you could other wise learn studying an ilco book for a week. If you go on the road you will learn to deal with so many problems way quicker, like impressioning locks, picking, opening cars, dealing with safes, installing hardware like new dead bolt installs, new mortise, wrap arounds, interlocks, latch guards, astragals, knob protectors, panic hard ware, door closures, knobs, creating and implementing master key systems on site. you name it and the road will throw it at you. If you don't get onto the road for 3 years you won't be able to do any of this for 3 years training in the field, what good will any knowledge be if your hands can't do the work? also think if you get up to 2 years and 8 months then get fired for some reason and you've been a shop locksmith with zero experience on the road, how could you benefit at another shop being a road locksmith when you are not capable of the work.

One of my apprentices was a shop locksmith, he was in the field for a year longer then i was but i was a 24 hour locksmith my entire career. He came to my shop and he couldn't even rekey a grade 2 schlage knobset. He could not get cylinder out of the knob. He tried installing one on site and he put the latch backwards in the door. This is my experience with a shop only locksmith and i vowed never to deal with one again. I would go with the smaller shop, you will learn alot more alot quicker with so much more opportunity there. Some people commented saying you will be used as labour, but they are wrong, at the small shop you will be used as a real on road locksmith. At the large shop you will be used for cheap labor to cut keys and so forth as i mentioned above, i believe they got confused with their statements because i don't agree with them. I know all the big shops and the small shops. They guys in my city in small shops with out big advertisement , just half a page in yellow pages, are the real locksmiths of the industry, we get into the dirty aspect of locksmith stuff that the big shops won't touch, so they never learn and we prosper because we have guts and we have 10 times more knowledge then anybody in a big shop. they do only fresh installs in new commercial buildings every day, and they have pre-setup master systems with computer software, they put pins in like a robot and install with templates like a robot. We don't. I eye out every custom astragal install, i setup master systems in my truck and implement it instantly. I've done it with "grand master, master, common and sub common" setup. When does a big shop do anything like this? I find the small shop 100 times more capable.

- Ermis

by **HeadHunterCEO** » 3 Mar 2007 0:39

Welcome Ermis

I scored an Apprenticeship :)

I scored an Apprenticeship :)

Re: I scored an Apprenticeship :)

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