Medeco's Exploited.

[fsdhy]

I guess shrub is rite. With some files and patience you can make any key you want.

Yep, Shrub is right. Almost anything has flaws that can be exploited by a determined attacker. ie any restricted key can be copied even if you don't have access to blanks, by casting from a mould.

The issue here is whether this is something that a locksmith like myself could use in the field, or is it something it takes 5 days stuck behind a shop bench to accomplish.

[Legion303]

I will correct my previous post by saying that Medeco cam locks with the 4 pin-inline design do exist, however, they are still not the same as normal medeco locks, because they have no shear line.

I have a 4-pin inline Medeco payphone lock that does have a shear line (also biaxial angled top pins, sidebar and mushroom drivers). :P

Although it's now a 2-pin Biaxial because I need more practice before I can pick all 4.

-steve

[Ermis]

I don't know what out dated mul-t-lock you have in stock, but i'm a mul-t-lock dealer and i have the latest and greatest and i can assure you, they where made bump proof a year ago. The older patent without the interactive pins are bumpable and pickable and the not so new interactive keyways sold with the older pin stacks are also. The new pin stacks contain serrated top pins, mushroom bottom pins, these pins can be used on the older patented keyways and the new ones and they do a beautiful job of preventing picking and bumping. There is only one guy in the city claiming to be able to pick a mul-t-lock cylinder but he won't let anybody re-key it with the new pin stack. I know it's possible to pick the older stacks and even bump them, but i have yet to be proven wrong on the new pin stacks. I will let you sit in my shop for hours holding a new cylinder we key up together and if you can pick it i'll let you keep it. PM me for directions i'm in vancouver BC.

[Schuyler]

I might have to buy EricM a plane ticket. Actually, I know he has had some plans for the newest generation, but has needed some funding. It'll be exciting if he gets it.

[Ermis]

fsdhy also i will be happy to meet you at the confrence, i will be taking the safe courses with an instructor 3 days in a row then i will attend the convention on the last day. I don't want to waste my time trying to impression a medeco because i know it's hard and a waste of time. But it is possible and i have done it, and i'll bring you the blank in your hand. The ilco blank is for a Corbin Russwin. I'm surprised nobody sent me a PM to ask what it is. I don't mind telling everybody as personally i don't think it's any kind of by pass method, i believe it's proof that medeco is not as good of a system as it claims and i'd be happy to prove it to the world. The blank literaly slides in without any modification to the grooves. All it requires is a small grazing on the bottom and top of the blade to shorten it's hight to fit in perfectly with zero movement in the keyway, it's perfectly snug. As we know even in an ITL-900 (amongst other code cutters) with the addon medeco cutting ability you can cut medeco keys to this blank and work them in locks. This completely prooves that it is not a restricted keyway and anybody with a code cutting machine can cut medeco keys by code. I think the system is sub-par standard with mul-t-lock on this basis alone.

[dosman]

Tell me, what Medeco lock is only 3 pins?

I have two of them, I'll try to post some pictures soon. They are electric switch locks with pin tumblers and a sidebar (No dimples and not a lame non-sidebar cabinet lock). The where originally for use on an RS/6000, I've not found this specific model referenced on medeco's website so far.

[zeke79]

Ermis,

I have yet to see a lock that was bumpable to begin with become unbumpable by only adding spool and serratted pins.

[Ermis]

it's the design of the new pins. the mushroomed bottom pins snatch onto the sheer line. they where made by mul-t-lock to prevent bumping. also the serrated top pins snag on the sheer line at the same time. I have all the blanks and cylinders in the world at my shop, and peterson is sending me one of their bump hammers, i'll play around with it and let you know my findings. but as of now i'll stick what can be proven and what is theory. I am a mul-t-lock dealer after all and i will stand by my product. so far nobody can dis prove the security of these locks in person it's just heresay.

[Schuyler]

Got pictures?

Are they similar to the pfaffenhain pins? http://www.toool.nl/Pfaffenhain_Cutaway_cylinders.pdf

I'd direct you to the proper page, but my computer is being s-l-o-w

[Squelchtone]

it's the design of the new pins. the mushroomed bottom pins snatch onto the sheer line. they where made by mul-t-lock to prevent bumping. also the serrated top pins snag on the sheer line at the same time. I have all the blanks and cylinders in the world at my shop, and peterson is sending me one of their bump hammers, i'll play around with it and let you know my findings. but as of now i'll stick what can be proven and what is theory. I am a mul-t-lock dealer after all and i will stand by my product. so far nobody can dis prove the security of these locks in person it's just heresay.

Here is a Russian lock site's video of a Mul-T-Lock Interactive being bumped open successfully. It takes him a while, but he does get it open.

http://www.locks.su/bump/multlock_interactive/multlock_interactive.asf


enjoy,

Squelchtone

[n2oah]

Tell me, what Medeco lock is only 3 pins?

I have two of them, I'll try to post some pictures soon. They are electric switch locks with pin tumblers and a sidebar (No dimples and not a lame non-sidebar cabinet lock). The where originally for use on an RS/6000, I've not found this specific model referenced on medeco's website so far.

Read the post directly below the one you quoted.


As far as drilling goes, which is a commonly used entry method, Mul-t-locks are MUCH easier than Medecos. Mul-t-lock's pins aren't very effective anti-pick pins. Usually, there is only 1 mushroom pin in a lock, and usually, all tops are serrated. Serrated pins don't do much.

[SmokieD]

Mul-t-locks are MUCH easier than Medecos. Mul-t-lock's pins aren't very effective anti-pick pins. Usually, there is only 1 mushroom pin in a lock, and usually, all tops are serrated. Serrated pins don't do much.

I know Multi T locks are bumpable, but I was under the impression they werent able to be picked. Ever... not with a tension wrench and pick..

[dosman]

Read the post directly below the one you quoted.

I'm missing something, you said Medeco's with 4 pins exist in your followup. I was affirming that Medeco's with 3 pins and a sidebar do exist. I guess I'm not clear on what a lock without a shear line is, are you meaning no sidebar?

[What]

I think n2oah is referring to medeco cam locks.

[Ermis]

I saw the video you posted about the mul-t-lock being bumped and again i would have to say i don't believe it can be done with the newer pin stacks being implemented, i believe that euro cylinder was an older interactive.