I scored an Apprenticeship :)

by **lunchb0x** » 3 Mar 2007 0:57

i agree with ermis, from what i have been told from locksmiths i know down south the larger companies are not that great, you will spend most of your apprentaship in a shop front, you would be really good at master key systems and rekeying locks but when it comes to fitting a lock or repairing one you might struggle, also with a big company becase there are so many locksmiths everyone does there own thing, one person might do the safes, a couple others will do automotive and then you will have your general locksmiths.

with a smaller company because there are lesss people you have to be able to do alot more, but what do you want out of it?, do you want to do general locksmithing, automotive or safe work, but if after a year or so you realise your not going to get a chance to get to do what you want have a look at what other companies have to offer you, but you should do what shrub sugested, ask if you can go on th road with the tradesmen during your own time and if they like you, you will find that they would probably go out of their way to help you out.

are you doing day classes at the collage or blocks?

either way im sure you will injoy it

by **Ermis** » 3 Mar 2007 13:54

Shrub's idea is the best and i agree. Take one of your free days and tag along with the locksmith. Find out what you will be doing and learning with him, get a feel for it and figure out for yourself what you think about his shop.

by **fsdhy** » 5 Mar 2007 10:40

HeadHunterCEO wrote:Really, why don't you tell me all about whats its like to be an actual locksmith. i would like to hear more about "commercial doors" for example

Why don't you do what an actual locksmith does, and read a book? :roll:

Aluminum Stile Door Service & Repair Manual by Jake Jakubuwski

I agree with Shrub, shadowing one of the other employees on your day off is a good idea... But don't offer that right away. At least make an attempt to be paid for your time before you give it away for nothing.

by **fsdhy** » 5 Mar 2007 10:47

Ermis wrote:Shrub's idea is the best and i agree. Take one of your free days and tag along with the locksmith. Find out what you will be doing and learning with him, get a feel for it and figure out for yourself what you think about his shop.

By the way, Ermis, have you ever been to the BCASP Convetion & Trade Show before? I am wondering if I should bring a bunch of cash, do the vendors offer their products for sale at the show? I'm looking to get a few high security padlocks, ie Mul-T-Lock & Abloy, plus a few other things while I'm there... Is that possible or is it just product demonstrations?

by **Ermis** » 5 Mar 2007 11:57

I have never attended before, most of their "member confrences" are so boring i never wanted to go, but for the first time in years the BCASP convention is passing through town at the end of march, you should be able to buy things there. i sell mul-t-lock padlocks in my shop.

by **Ermis** » 5 Mar 2007 12:03

I'm taking their "comprehensive safe" & "manipulation 1" & "manipulation 2" course starting march 28 i think at the BCASP convention. It will prepare me for my STPRP exam with aloa. i'm so excited

by **fsdhy** » 5 Mar 2007 12:06

Ermis wrote:I have never attended before, most of their "member confrences" are so boring i never wanted to go, but for the first time in years the BCASP convention is passing through town at the end of march, you should be able to buy things there. i sell mul-t-lock padlocks in my shop.

My shop is in a small town, high security stuff is hard to find without driving an hour+. High security stuff doesn't move fast around here, so its not worth it for me to stock stuff like that. The padlocks are for my own personal use though... I know Mike Burns, a Mul-T-Lock territory manager, is teaching a course + they have a booth, so I thought maybe I could save myself some shipping $$$ and buy them while I was at the convention. I just wanted to make sure they actually sold things at the show, and don't just do demonstrations, etc. Thanks. You going?

by **fsdhy** » 5 Mar 2007 12:12

Ermis wrote:I'm taking their "comprehensive safe" & "manipulation 1" & "manipulation 2" course starting march 28 i think at the BCASP convention. It will prepare me for my STPRP exam with aloa. i'm so excited

I wish I could say I'd see you there... Unfortunately, I'm only preparing for PRP L-00 at the moment... I'm taking "Professional Lock Picking", "Professional Impressioning Techniques" and "Alternate Entry Techniques"... Yeah, I know, its stuff I already do all day long... But I want to make sure I know the technical details required for L-00.

As long as I've got at least my CRL by July, I should be taking a few STPRP prep courses at the ALOA convention..

by **globallockytoo** » 5 Mar 2007 20:24

Way to go Tommy. I told you you could do it. Good on you for taking the job with the bigger company. I did my apprenticeship with 3 different companies in Melbourne in the early 80's. The 3rd company was the largest locksmith company in Australia. I learned a great deal from many experienced lockies and even though I worked generally in-house (I was promoted to an assistant manager in my 3rd year) I occasionally still went out in the road.

Even if they put you in different departments for 6 months at a time...the training will be worth it. The tech school system for locksmiths in Australia, is second to none.

At the end of your apprenticeship...you could earn as much as $15-20 per hour, have a fully maintained company service vehicle and tools, excellent superannuation package...and with after hours work, you could make $60-70 K per year.

Find your niche and then after a couple of years look to go out on your own. But...make sure you get the training...and become an independant roadside technician because the experience of solving clients lock issues on the road, without requiring to constantly go back to the shop will benefit you greatly in future years.

Is the company Integrity Locksmiths by chance?

by **Ermis** » 7 Mar 2007 15:04

fsdhy wrote:
Ermis wrote:I have never attended before, most of their "member confrences" are so boring i never wanted to go, but for the first time in years the BCASP convention is passing through town at the end of march, you should be able to buy things there. i sell mul-t-lock padlocks in my shop.

My shop is in a small town, high security stuff is hard to find without driving an hour+. High security stuff doesn't move fast around here, so its not worth it for me to stock stuff like that. The padlocks are for my own personal use though... I know Mike Burns, a Mul-T-Lock territory manager, is teaching a course + they have a booth, so I thought maybe I could save myself some shipping $$$ and buy them while I was at the convention. I just wanted to make sure they actually sold things at the show, and don't just do demonstrations, etc. Thanks. You going?

I know mike burns, he's my sponsor for aloa, he's in my shop all the time. I can introduce you to him at the convention if you'd like. He told me about the BCASP convention comming into town, and when he mentioned the safe courses i signed up right away. We should get together when you are in town or meet up at the convention. I know Vancouver really well and i got VIP at a few nice night clubs / fancy pubs. I did the safes and locks for so many places i gave a good rate and took VIP in exchange.
I just finished working on Celies night club in downtown, it's brand new and really nice, three story high, the top floor is an out door environment of the night club, it's great.

by **HeadHunterCEO** » 7 Mar 2007 23:00

fsdhy wrote:
HeadHunterCEO wrote:Get on the road as soon as possible.
If you lurk this site and have read all the stickies than you already know enough about the basics.

Not true at all. Worst advice I've ever heard.

This site has info on all the fun stuff, but not much info on things a locksmith encounters day to day. Blank identification, most common lock malfunctions, installation, door closers, electronic access control, automative, commercial doors, master key systems, etc etc the list goes on and on.

FYI, there's a big difference between picking a lock thats in your hand/on your bench than picking a lock in negative 20 degree weather with an audience.

You don't know the job just because you read about it on the internet, sorry.

Guy I am a practicing locksmith and I will tell you something right now that you may realize after your done taking all your classes.
Being a locksmith is easy.
Learing the locksmith trade should not be that hard at all.
If you can't pick it up in a van on the run with it after being shown the basics then you will be mediocre at best.
So as I previously stated to the OP , get on the road as soon as possible if you wish to get better faster.

by **lunchb0x** » 8 Mar 2007 7:01

HeadHunter is right, being a locksmith isnt hard, as long as you are happy just opening houses, changing locks and doing all that simple boring stuff, but doing all this can lead to bigger and better things, like opening safes or installing house alarms, these things arnt that easy and if anyone tells you they are they probably havent dont many of them.
when your in shop it will be the most boring time of your life, and very repedative but the hand skills and people skills you learn you will definatly need to be on the road.
you also learn how to deal with having anoying customers standing at the counter yelling at you because they wanted there job done yesterday but only come in today to get it done.
but on the other hand spending to much time in a shop is bad, at work we get alot of trades people from other parts of australia where they spend around 3 years in shop, there very quick and good at hand cutting safe keys but when you send them out to hang a door or change a safe combination they dont know what to do.
But it is very interesting work and if you get really good at it yu=ou will get paid alot for it asewll

by **fsdhy** » 8 Mar 2007 20:39

Guy I am a practicing locksmith and I will tell you something right now that you may realize after your done taking all your classes.
Being a locksmith is easy.
Learing the locksmith trade should not be that hard at all.
If you can't pick it up in a van on the run with it after being shown the basics then you will be mediocre at best.
So as I previously stated to the OP , get on the road as soon as possible if you wish to get better faster.

"Guy", I knew you were a locksmith before I posted the first time. I've read your other posts. Just because you are a locksmith doesn't mean you can go around giving shoddy advice to the newbies.

Being a locksmith is definitely easy, you are right. Compared to the years I spent at school, its monkey work. HOWEVER, THERE IS NO REASON TO GO AROUND TELLING JOE PUBLIC THAT YOUR JOB IS EASY. He will not want to pay your prices. He will try to do the job himself. ETC. Telling people interested in the trade is EVEN WORSE. They will go into the job thinking they know it all and put no effort into it.

Get it now, "guy"? What you are suggesting is not the proper way to learn.

FYI, I will never be "done taking classes". I've got a BA, will have an MBA within 3 years, and I will never even use it but I don't care. I am taking locksmith related courses at the same time, as well as running a shop. If there's one thing I won't do, its stop learning. Obviously, you seem content with what you know and you may even think that you know it all. All I have to say about that is good for you, sir. Someday I hope to be as wise as you. Keep up the good work telling everyone that my profession is monkey work.

by **HeadHunterCEO** » 8 Mar 2007 22:31

"Guy", I knew you were a locksmith before I posted the first time. I've read your other posts. Just because you are a locksmith doesn't mean you can go around giving shoddy advice to the newbies.

Being a locksmith is definitely easy, you are right. Compared to the years I spent at school, its monkey work. HOWEVER, THERE IS NO REASON TO GO AROUND TELLING JOE PUBLIC THAT YOUR JOB IS EASY. He will not want to pay your prices. He will try to do the job himself. ETC. Telling people interested in the trade is EVEN WORSE. They will go into the job thinking they know it all and put no effort into it.
gUY
Get it now, "guy"? What you are suggesting is not the proper way to learn.

FYI, I will never be "done taking classes". I've got a BA, will have an MBA within 3 years, and I will never even use it but I don't care. I am taking locksmith related courses at the same time, as well as running a shop. If there's one thing I won't do, its stop learning. Obviously, you seem content with what you know and you may even think that you know it all. All I have to say about that is good for you, sir. Someday I hope to be as wise as you. Keep up the good work telling everyone that my profession is monkey work.

Guy the proper way to learn is in the field. You don't get it and or don't agree with that.
Thats OK because it is your opinion versus mine
I have said to OP what i believe
thats all

by **Ermis** » 9 Mar 2007 13:33

I have to disagree 100% with your comment, being a locksmith is not easy.
If you think being a locksmith is easy then you obviously have not enough experience on your own, or you are not a real locksmith and you have no real life experience practicing the field. Or you live in a very small town and you never do anything except open cars and pick the occasional lock.

In a larger city being a locksmith can be very stressful and aggravating.
I will start it off with customers giving wrong information over the phone when taking a call, this is almost 90% of the time.
Next we drive to the site, bad drivers on the road can make a bad day 10 times worst. And for me, it takes me longer to drive to a site then it does to finish my work, so i'm driving 60% of the day.
Next i arrive on site and i'm greeted by either:
A.) a person who discourages me and does not trust me (i am fully bonded, licensed, certified) and i work at a shop that has been around for 15 years.
B.) A person who is so incredibly cheap they refuse to listen to recommendations and insist I Repair and Fix broken locks which end up costing the same in labour as it would to replace. And you don't have parts so you have to making springs (this part is fun) to repair the lock, but they call you 3 months later because the repair is not functioning anymore and they did not listen to your advise to replace the first time when you knew better. And now they try to blame you for the lock being broken and want warrenty on a repair. .. haha i love when this happens (sarcastic)
C.) A cheap bussiness that refuses to change their keyway with their master system, and they want additional master systems implemented in an existing master thats been around for 10 years already, and you know every combination known to man has been cut and handed to the company over the years for this key way. So now you need to implement an additional master system praying that ONE old key out there does not open a specific door... this is not an easy task when they have had 20 different full master systems using 4 levels of authenticity over 10 years on a Corbin L4 (for example). Go find the specific possible combinations without all the keys in your hand because they are too lazy to go find them all. And this system would be implemented over 30 or so locks.

I can go on, and on, and on. If our job was so easy then everybody would do it themselfs. To me, alot of my job seems easy to me because i know what i'm doing and i do it quickly and make it look natural. But to everybody else it's hard work. There are things about our jobs that make it difficult and you need to understand that before you make comments like the one you made earlier "GUY". I can't agree with you at all. I love locks like a hobbiest and to me isn't not a job, it's enjoyment but the work aspect of it can be a pain in the butt.

I scored an Apprenticeship :)

Who is online