Tri-shear line locks?

[bumber]

Is there any locks that have shears that you have to put the key in turn it, push it a little more, turn it then push&turn again???? This prob. dont make sense but is a serious ?. Im sure some mods or exp. persons will have something to say!

[Shrub]

I domnt know of any pin tumbler locks to be honest,

There are some lever locks that work a simular princeable but pin tumblers i cant think of any personally,

Is it interest or are you thinking of new lock designs or tool designs etc?

[raimundo]

I think your idea could be clearer to yourself or others if you draw it, that said, some members do not put their inventions in the public domain until they have given the patent lawyer all their money.

[hesevil]

From reading your post, this is what I think you are trying to desribe:

For example, we will use a 5-pin key. The lock, in the locked position, would only allow you to insert the key to a depth of 1 pin. You would put the key in, turn it say 15 degrees. After this rotation, you could now insert the key 1 pin deeper for a total of 2 pins and turn the key another 15 degrees. So every 15 degrees of rotation, you would be able to insert the key 1 pin deeper and turn until you had finally inserted it all 5 pins and completed unlocking the lock.

Is this similar to what you had in mind?

[Shrub]

Thats pretty much how i assumed it was except i didnt think that far into it as regards number of pins etc,

There are lever locks that require the key to be turned in an outer lock before entering the keyway of the inner lock,

[bumber]

From reading your post, this is what I think you are trying to desribe:

For example, we will use a 5-pin key. The lock, in the locked position, would only allow you to insert the key to a depth of 1 pin. You would put the key in, turn it say 15 degrees. After this rotation, you could now insert the key 1 pin deeper for a total of 2 pins and turn the key another 15 degrees. So every 15 degrees of rotation, you would be able to insert the key 1 pin deeper and turn until you had finally inserted it all 5 pins and completed unlocking the lock.

Is this similar to what you had in mind?

YUP except there would be like atleast 3 pins per turn to secrure it and minimize time spent with the real key.
This is both interest and poss. design, I dont know if it would be much harder to pick but. I was also thinking each set of pins would increase in difficulty, to confuse would be thefts.

I'm currently working on a wooden prototype to get clearence/tolerence/specs. once this is done I shall TRY to construct some come of working model. (Although do to difficulty please only hold me to the wooden set!! )

[Jolly Rodgers]

i would design it so that all the sections have security pins instead of starting easy to pick and work its way up. this way a inexperienced picker would give up well before the end of the lock

[bumber]

yeah but if i did it my way an inexperianced picker would start it get the 1st set, YAY!. 2nd set, not too bad. 3rd set WTF is going on AAAAAHHHHHHH!!!!!

[Shrub]

All you need is a plug as normal and then a lock case that has lines of holes at differant points,

Insert the key fully, the key touches 6 pins but the last 3 dont have holkes above them for top pins and springs but the first 3 do, there could be holes above the last three pins so that if manipulated and manipulated too high they lock the lock up but thats an additional factor to think about,

Turn the plug perhaps 30' and then another set of holes in the case is come on, this set has pins in the last 3 positions and clear holes in the first three, havign the right key in allows the plug to simply continue to turn around, having the wrong key in or picking it will simply set the lock again but this time on the last 3 pins,

Turn the plug again and you get all 6 pins setting in holes,

Now the thing with this sort of lock is that a spinner would get around it easily but bumping wont work on it especialy if its key retaining,

On your idea of pushing a key in then further in etc etc then what you will have to start thinking about is the issue that a set pin stack will not alow the key to be pushed further in unless the following cuts are lower than the first ones, this dramatically reduces the number of combos the lock can have,

[hesevil]

I would suppose that before you follow through with a model, you need have a goal in mind. We know that you want to create a novel lock design, but what is the design of this lock supposed to accomplish? Are you trying to be pick resistant? bump resistant? pick and bump resistant? etc etc.

Depending on the reason you want to construct a new lock design, there are different specific ways to go about the same general activity. I don't know if that makes sense, hopefully it does.

-Matt

[Budmaster11]

Very intersting design idea, but pretty complicated. What if you stuck the key in 4 pins deep, turned it CCW 45 degrees, stuck it in 5 pins deep then turned it CW 135 degrees degrees. This way the tension tool would have to be taken out then put back in causing any pins that where set to drop back down, also if it were new on the market your average lock picker would not know to turn it CCW first. Of course the CCW turn would have to disable some sort of stopper otherwise it would be possible to pick it normally.

[JackNco]

I think the main problems with this are

1 - People would become frustrated doing this every time they used the lock. i know it would last about a week before i changed it out. (Plus i can see people snapping keys after a skin full)

2 - having to explain thats how you use the lock every time some one gets a key

3 - Removing the key. pulling a key out one pin at a time means you have to think about it.

But its an interesting idea dont get me wrong.

[bumber]

I knew I would get a lot of responses, and im glad nobody was like"dude thats dumb...etc.." The reason I posted it before I tried it is b/c i knew the pins would not work like that so i wanted more ideas w/out just asking a potentually dumb question. But now I have a good idea as how to make this somewhat work. I have to work alot this week so it will be this weekend before i can post pics.(if said pics I have)


P.S. it wont be pick proof I dont think but it WILL be frustrating!!

[bumber]

Turn the plug perhaps 30' and then another set of holes in the case is come on, this set has pins in the last 3 positions and clear holes in the first three, havign the right key in allows the plug to simply continue to turn around, having the wrong key in or picking it will simply set the lock again but this time on the last 3 pins,

Turn the plug again and you get all 6 pins setting in holes,

Now the thing with this sort of lock is that a spinner would get around it easily but bumping wont work on it especialy if its key retaining,,

That was the idea I started with as to make it bump proof, but LP101 is not BK101. Although we talk about it from time to time,so I wanted to make it more pick retarded if you will. I think ANY lock with a key IS able to be manipulated, BUT how hard that may be is the question. So I have a few things to consider. I bet its somthing very simple made complicated will solve(or make) a problem!