Multiple Impressioning Questions

[Exodus5000]

I've been promising myself I'd get the supplies necessary to impression for a while now. After reading this thread I've determined that I'll get myself a large vice grips for gripping the blank.

While reading this article: http://www.gregmiller.net/locks/impress.html#3.0 I noticed they recommended using a #4 Pippin file. Luckilly http://tinyurl.com/36266l sells 3 types of Pippin files, and I was wondering if someone with some more experience could suggest which one they prefer?

So my supplies will look like this:
-Large Vice Grips
-An electronic calipers
-An undetermined Pippin file
-Brass Key blanks.

Is there anything else that you would suggest I buy?

And last but not least, could someone with a bit of time on their hands post a picture in this thread of a properly prepared "knifed edge" on a key blank? Would one continually "knife" the edge of a blank as they impression, or is knifing an edge only used at the beginning to find the first marks?

Thanks in advance.

[keysman]

While reading this article: http://www.gregmiller.net/locks/impress.html#3.0 I noticed they recommended using a #4 Pippin file. Luckilly http://tinyurl.com/36266l sells 3 types of Pippin files, and I was wondering if someone with some more experience could suggest which one they prefer?

So my supplies will look like this:
-Large Vice Grips
-An electronic calipers
-An undetermined Pippin file
-Brass Key blanks.

Is there anything else that you would suggest I buy?

Well, everybody has their own preferences, I learned with a rattail and small vice grips, Now I use a # 4 pippin and a pair of larger VGs designed for impressioning ( they have smooth jaws so they won’t mar up the key)
I don’t know if the link you gave is a sponsor, but there is a member here who sells some pretty nice impressioning equipment for a very reasonable price.

A magnifying visor is helpful unless your eyesight is perfect ++, and a smooth flat file is handy for preparing the blanks, and a good flashlight is helpful for catching the “ shadows”

You may want to start out with a master padlock # 3 or #1. Be sure you run some solvent through the cylinder to make it as “ dry as possible” , I like brake cleaner , but other quick evaporating solvents work well also .. Oil is your enemy when impressioning.. keep the lock dry for the best results.
Key blanks … brass not silver( nickel plated) or steel

[Squelchtone]

Thanks for the good info Keysman.

I have a question regarding older padlocks with wafers instead of pins.

A friend brought me his old Ilco padlock, round body, very old, maybe 1920-1960. I picked it easily, and noticed it has what looks like 4 wafers.

He does not have a key, so I'd like to try my hand at impressioning it. After I find the proper blank, will impressioning a wafer lock be easier than a pin tumbler style lock?

Or... should I look around for a guide to reading wafers instead?

Thanks for your help,

Squelchtone

[pelham123]

Well it's Saturday night and I've just returned from Locksmithing school so I thought I'd chime in on this one. Impressioning is a lot of practise. Also , it's all in the wrist. The 5 impressioning steps are 1: select the proper key blank. 2: blade the key. 3: insert the key. 4: bump the key. 5: File the marks. The hard part for me is seeing the marks. I find that if you are inside go to a window and cup your hand overthe blank to form shadows for those first few critical marks. I use a pippin file to start and then switch to a swiss #4 round file.The trick is in distinguishing the marks. I don't see a need for dial calipers while impressioning. a swiss round or pippin file and a 6 inch vice grips is all you need if you have good eyes. If you're over 50 get a set of magnifiers for 20 bucks. You'll need them . Hope this helps.

[maxxed]

I have a question regarding older padlocks with wafers instead of pins.

A friend brought me his old Ilco padlock, round body, very old, maybe 1920-1960. I picked it easily, and noticed it has what looks like 4 wafers.

He does not have a key, so I'd like to try my hand at impressioning it. After I find the proper blank, will impressioning a wafer lock be easier than a pin tumbler style lock?

Or... should I look around for a guide to reading wafers instead?

Thanks for your help,

Squelchtone

definitely try reading, first wafers may be weak in the old lock and a bent wafer can cause a lot of problems. I think the best lock to start on is the Ford 5 pin locks , used from 1964 up to the late 1980"s, different models were switched to the 10 wafer at different times. This lock uses a heavy keyblank so it can take some abuse, as a noob to impresioning don't start with the more delicate locks, and start with the smaller vice grips so excessive force means pain in the hand

[87ELC2]

I personally prefer a Grobet #4 pippin file with ordinary 10" Vise-grips to hold the blank. The large Vise-grip clamps the key bow better than the smaller ones, and the serrations on the jaw really lock it in. The large size also means less hand fatigue during the bind-and-bump motion. The pippin file shape makes it easier to cut the slopes in each position to prevent pins/wafers from hanging up.

I don't care about marks on the bow because I never give my customers an impressioned key - I only use the impression as a guide to code-cut a proper new key.

My impressioning style for wafer locks is actually a combination of impressioning and reading. I'll read as much as I can and make appropriate cuts on my code cutter, then use standard impressioning techniques until the key works. At that point, I decode the impressioned key and code-cut a perfect new key.

[freakparade3]

I would not recommend using large vice grips if you are new to impressioning. Until you get to know the ammount of pressure needed to mark the blank large vice grips will most likely just make you bend or break keys. My camera quit so I can't post a pic but if you look down the blade of a knife you will know what a knife edged key blank should look like. Just be sure not to file the top of the keyblank lower when adding the edge to the blank. Another method is covering the blank with marker. I find a blue or red sharpie works best. Knife edging is my preferred method. The type of keyblank is another big factor, brass keys are easiest to impression, but also break off easily when applying turning pressure to make the marks. It takes alot of practice, try impressioning with 1 or 2 pins first, similar to DB's beginners exercise for picking. I have spent alot of time learning this art, if you have any more questions feel free to PM me. I'll help the best I can.

[raimundo]

impressioning is an art, like picking, too much force breaks blanks, reading the marks is crucial and not always straightforward, sometimes you hope/guess if your impressioning something like a best lock on nicklesilver blank,
I use the mini vice grips, the smallest, I moved to that one after using the little six inch ones when they were the smallest. I cut a little notch in the back of the bow of the key, then clamp the vise grip downhard with the wire cutter in that knotch, this eliminates any smearing and moveing in the jaw of the vise grip.
If I used a big 10 inch vise grip, I'd just be wasting blanks. the big plier is a factor in the whole feel of it, its an art, and to those who use the big plier, they know what works for them, the way they studied it.
I am currently using a grobetswiss sixth cut ten inch rattail, I have always used rattail to impression, I learned it that long ago. a second cut file is good enough, a fourth cut is excelent, the sixth cut is too fine but I had the file so I work with It.

[Shrub]

A caliper is very useful if you have the space and depth charts,

A magnifier is a must,