Having read the FAQ's you are still unfulfilled and seek more enlightenment, so post your general lock picking questions here.
Forum rules
Do not post safe related questions in this sub forum! Post them in This Old Safe
The sub forum you are currently in is for asking Beginner Hobby Lock Picking questions only.
by LeeNo » 25 Oct 2007 19:14
In deciding which tention wrench to use for a given lock, which property is considered paramount?
Depth, width or height?
Let me explain what I am talking about as I don't know the proper terms (assuming their are lingo terms for what I am talking about).
The "depth" is what I am calling how far into the keyway the tension wrench extends.
The "width" is what I am calling how fat the wrench is. Obviously a wrench with too much width won't even fit in the keyway.
The "height" is what I am calling how much vertical space within the keyway the wrench occupies.
So, which of these measurements is the most important?
Also, I have watched many lockpick vids on YouTube and am not sure I understand how the tension wrench should be used.
Should it be used like a key (twisting/torque)? If so, this means that a wrench with a width smaller than the keyway would be creating an angular pressure point on both high on the key ward opposite of the direction of tension and low on the key ward on the direction of tension.
Or should it be used on an arc perpendicular to the keyway (frontal pressure)? If so, no angular pressure points would exist and a direct pressure point would be created that is evenly distributed within the keyway on the side being tensioned.
<sig>
-
LeeNo
-
- Posts: 197
- Joined: 16 Oct 2007 11:07
- Location: Silver Spring, MD
-
by MacGyver101 » 25 Oct 2007 19:27
LeeNo wrote:In deciding which tention wrench to use for a given lock, which property is considered paramount?
The thickness ('width') of the tension wrench is the most important dimension (in my own experience, anyhow). When setting security pins, in particular, you need to be able to both apply tension and release tension in a controlled manner -- and a properly-fitting tension wrench is essential to this. If the wrench is too thin (relative to the width of the keyway) it becomes more difficult to reduce your tension and allow for a slight "backwards" rotation of the cylinder. With a wrench that is too thick, you're much more limited in how you can insert it. (And I'll leave the obvious joke hanging for someone else to swing at...)  LeeNo wrote:Should [a tension wrench] be used like a key (twisting/torque)?
Yes. It's a poorly-named tool: " torque wrench" would probably be much more descriptive.
-

MacGyver101
- Moderator Emeritus
-
- Posts: 1560
- Joined: 21 Jun 2006 14:40
- Location: Toronto, Canada
by LeeNo » 25 Oct 2007 19:38
MacGyver101 wrote:If the wrench is too thin (relative to the width of the keyway) it becomes more difficult to reduce your tension and allow for a slight "backwards" rotation of the cylinder.
Does this mean, then, that your tension wrench should be as wide as possible while still allowing for a minimally frictive insertion? MacGyver101 wrote:With a wrench that is too thick, you're much more limited in how you can insert it. (And I'll leave the obvious joke hanging for someone else to swing at...) 
D'OH! MacGyver101 wrote:LeeNo wrote:Should [a tension wrench] be used like a key (twisting/torque)?
Yes. It's a poorly-named tool: " torque wrench" would probably be much more descriptive.
Thanks much! I was worried about a too-thin tension wrench damaging locks when the torque in the wrench was transferred to the opposite keyward. It aslo seemed to me that slippage could occur if the wrench were too thin, deep or short.
<sig>
-
LeeNo
-
- Posts: 197
- Joined: 16 Oct 2007 11:07
- Location: Silver Spring, MD
-
by MacGyver101 » 25 Oct 2007 19:47
LeeNo wrote:Does this mean, then, that your tension wrench should be as wide as possible while still allowing for a minimally frictive insertion?
Ideally, yes. (Again, this is in my experience, anyhow.) In practice, you'll find that you can't practically carry enough wrenches to precisely fit every keyway you'll encounter; I have a few that vary in thickness and give me some options to work with. LeeNo wrote:I was worried about a too-thin tension wrench damaging locks when the torque in the wrench was transferred to the opposite keyward.
You'll find that you require very, very little pressure on the tension wrench: you're only having to apply enough force to overcome the spring pressure on the pins. (And the pins are being driven by very, very tiny springs.)
-

MacGyver101
- Moderator Emeritus
-
- Posts: 1560
- Joined: 21 Jun 2006 14:40
- Location: Toronto, Canada
by Gordon Airporte » 25 Oct 2007 20:01
LeeNo wrote:MacGyver101 wrote:If the wrench is too thin (relative to the width of the keyway) it becomes more difficult to reduce your tension and allow for a slight "backwards" rotation of the cylinder.
Does this mean, then, that your tension wrench should be as wide as possible while still allowing for a minimally frictive insertion?
Yep. You seem like a guy who owns dial calipers so I'll give you the dimensions of a wrench that I find quite versatile.
.118" x .031" x around 3/4" on one end, and on the other end, for the top of the keyway .115" x .031" x .177"
The trick is finding the ~.03" thick wiper insert. Try to leave the edges square when you file so it catches the keyway better.
That's just one wrench, but another really important 'dimension' is the number of different wrenches you have. They're free, and easy to make, so make a bunch and experiment. Eventually you'll settle on a few that you like best.
-
Gordon Airporte
-
- Posts: 812
- Joined: 15 Sep 2005 13:22
- Location: Baltimore
by LeeNo » 25 Oct 2007 20:03
MacGyver101 wrote:LeeNo wrote:Does this mean, then, that your tension wrench should be as wide as possible while still allowing for a minimally frictive insertion?
Ideally, yes. (Again, this is in my experience, anyhow.) In practice, you'll find that you can't practically carry enough wrenches to precisely fit every keyway you'll encounter; I have a few that vary in thickness and give me some options to work with. LeeNo wrote:I was worried about a too-thin tension wrench damaging locks when the torque in the wrench was transferred to the opposite keyward.
You'll find that you require very, very little pressure on the tension wrench: you're only having to apply enough force to overcome the spring pressure on the pins. (And the pins are being driven by very, very tiny springs.)
Thank you so much MacGyver101! I know my questions sound very obvious, but I am trying to understand the forces at play here first.
The point about only needing to overcome the pressure of the springs now seems obvious because they are the only force at play (ignoring the friction between the housing and cylinder itself), but I wasn't thinking that way - now I am. And it makes sense.
Thanks again!
<sig>
-
LeeNo
-
- Posts: 197
- Joined: 16 Oct 2007 11:07
- Location: Silver Spring, MD
-
by LeeNo » 25 Oct 2007 20:09
Gordon Airporte wrote:You seem like a guy who owns dial calipers
LOL!
Actually, I don't
But I used to be an aircraft electrician (and I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night....) and find I work better when I understand the actors in play.
<sig>
-
LeeNo
-
- Posts: 197
- Joined: 16 Oct 2007 11:07
- Location: Silver Spring, MD
-
by josh0094 » 25 Oct 2007 21:05
harbor frieght tools is awsome! look it up!
-
josh0094
-
- Posts: 591
- Joined: 13 Oct 2007 14:44
- Location: oregon
-
by MacGyver101 » 25 Oct 2007 21:15
josh0094 wrote:harbor frieght tools is awsome! look it up!
Um... okay. I'm sure they are. 
-

MacGyver101
- Moderator Emeritus
-
- Posts: 1560
- Joined: 21 Jun 2006 14:40
- Location: Toronto, Canada
by josh0094 » 25 Oct 2007 21:36
there the home depot version of the doller tree
-
josh0094
-
- Posts: 591
- Joined: 13 Oct 2007 14:44
- Location: oregon
-
by mitch.capper » 25 Oct 2007 22:45
Also one tension wrench isnt going to satisfy all your needs, different keyways and different tension options. You will find some locks you have to pick from the top and will need a shallow wrench. Really its best to try and figure out what locks you would like to be attempting, and custom a wrench to each rather one to all.
-
mitch.capper
- Supporter

-
- Posts: 208
- Joined: 18 Sep 2007 20:02
- Location: USA
-
by criminalhate » 26 Oct 2007 14:48
josh0094 wrote:harbor frieght tools is awsome! look it up!
I'm pretty sure he was mentioning it because they sell cheap($9.99 us) digital calipers that work ok for most of what we do (I own a pair).
-
criminalhate
-
- Posts: 511
- Joined: 29 Aug 2006 11:49
- Location: Detroit (westland) MI
by rakemaster » 26 Oct 2007 15:35
Dial (or digital) calipers have gotten so cheap that there's really
no excuse for someone interested in locks not owning one.
I prefer the dial kind myself, no batteries to worry about.
-
rakemaster
-
- Posts: 273
- Joined: 2 Dec 2003 17:56
- Location: California
Return to Got Questions? - Ask Beginner Hobby Lockpicking Questions Here
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 9 guests
|