My experiences starting out.

[anoncoward]

I started out with a Christmas gift of a Southord PXS-17 lock pick set and the 'Visual Guide to Lock picking". My dad used to pick locks for fun, and I tried taking apart some master combination locks in high school. That was ovr 20 years ago! I'm a security engineer, and I've always had an interest in lock picking, but never did anything about it. This gift was perfect for me.

I've been reading the 'Visual Guide', as well as the MIT Guide & the LSI guide and I decided that I should actually start trying some of this out. On the way home yesterday evening I stopped by Home Depot and picked up two cheap locks. One was a 'Defiant' lock ($9) and the other was a Kwikset ($12). The Defiant appears to be set up so that you can't get at the pins to change them, but the Kwikset has a snap-on clasp holding the pins in. Neither looks like you can extract the plug, but that's OK.

On the Kwikset, I started by turning the key a few times to get the normal feel of operation. After all, that's what we're trying to fake with a pick. I worked the wrench & got a feel for how far it turns before the pins hit, and tried probing the pins just to see if I could count them (it's a five pin lock, but I wasn't sure). Then I started to take the lock apart. I got a stack of Dixie cups, and used one cup per pin stack. I keep them stacked in order so that as I reassemble it, the key that came with the lock will still work.

There were two things that surprised me about this lock. The first was that while the driver pins had sharp corners, the key pins were beveled. From what I read, beveled pins are used as a security measure for the driver pins but I've never read anything about it for the key pins. Then it hit me: They're beveled to allow easier key passage. The second thing that surprised me is that all the driver pins are the same length. I didn't realize that they were, I had assumed that each pin stack together would be the same length. Some things you need to see to understand!

After taking the lock apart a few times & reassembling I was very confident that I could always bring it back to functioning condition. This was a good time for me to start with digital_blue's exercises.

I was able to pick both locks last night, and taking apart the Kwikset was a big help. I've been practicing all day. The Defiant lock is a little harder for me to pick, I usually get it at least every other try. I need to get a better feel for the pins, and the exercises certainly help.

Thanks to everyone who's been posting, it's really appreciated.

- Ed

[muskratt]

the Defiant locks usually come standard with a spool. single pin picking that will be a great way to practice.

[muskratt]

Neither looks like you can extract the plug, but that's OK.

you can extract the plug. you need to remove the clip on the back of the plug then stick the key in, turn about 20 degrees and then use a plug follower to push the plug out from the back.

p.s. if you dont have a follower then you can use either a sharpie, battery or something similar in size and diameter of the plug

[anoncoward]

I'm not sure what you mean by a spool. The lock itself looks fairly solid, there are two deep holes at the back that may be for unscrewing it, but not much else. Around the back of the plug there's a pin that can be pressed & the housing around it can spin to the next pin position. I can't find any good pictures to show you what I mean.

- Ed

[zsoutendijk]

Welcome To LP101!

this vid should explain spools, even though its only like 6 seconds

http://youtube.com/watch?v=enFRn189Qo0

this site has some good info

http://www.fortliberty.org/military-library/guide-to-lock-picking.shtml

and if you can...watch "visual guide to lockpicking"

Good Luck!

-Zack

[anoncoward]

Thanks, that explains a lot. I'll keep practicing!

- Ed

[anoncoward]

I tried with a Master #3 padlock. This lock was laying around teh office for a year or so because nobody knew where the key was. It was for a PC security strap that was never used.

I had tried this lock a few times before to single pin pick it with no lick at all (I can't feel the pins bind on it at all). I tried switching to a small half-diamond pick and raking it. I saw some videos of people raking this lock while alternating pressure on the wrench. I tried it that way, and after a minute it popped open. Joy! I've been trying again several times using the same method, with no luck. Is raking pure chance, or is my method messed up?

- Ed

[raimundo]

stop thinking about it, don't try to understand it, pick it while watching tv and you will find that the communication between the feel of the lock and your hand is something you can't intelectualize. So stop thinking about it, and lighten up on the tensor. your fingers will learn something ineffable.

[dougfarre]

the Defiant locks usually come standard with a spool. single pin picking that will be a great way to practice.

Which Defiant locks come withs spools? Are you talking about the deadbolts? Are you sure of this? I don't think Defiant deadbolts come with spool pins...

[anoncoward]

I'm working with a defiant deadbolt lock. One thing that I see all the time with it is that when certain pins set, it will move as if I've unlocked it but then stops. From the video about spools that zsoutendijk linked to, I think this may have them. That said, I have about a weekend's worth of experience!

- Ed

[gf1984]

...Around the back of the plug there's a pin that can be pressed & the housing around it can spin to the next pin position. I can't find any good pictures to show you what I mean.

- Ed

Hold that pin down and turn the ring until it comes off. It only stops at the next pin position if you don't hold it down. Then you can remove the plug (turn first to the side so that driver pins will be against the side of the plug and use plug follower.)

--Steve

[dougfarre]

I'm working with a defiant deadbolt lock. One thing that I see all the time with it is that when certain pins set, it will move as if I've unlocked it but then stops. From the video about spools that zsoutendijk linked to, I think this may have them. That said, I have about a weekend's worth of experience!

- Ed

It is possible that the tolerances on the Defiant are just so bad that when you pick certain pins the plug will turn like its been unlocked then stop. Then all you have to do is keep picking. Its good when this happens, because it means your on the right track. I don't think it is becasue of a security pin, but I could be wrong.

[dboeren]

Congratulations on your start in the hobby. I started almost exactly the same way a couple of weeks ago, getting my SouthOrd 14 piece set for xmas and my wife had a practice board made up with a Kwikset deadbolt and Defiant deadbolt.

I definately agree that Defiant is harder to open than Kwikset. I can get it, but it takes more time and a more careful feel. I do not know whether there are any spool pins, but I suspect that there are not.

Masterlock 1, 3, and 5 seem to be the same lock from a picking perspective, they come just in three different sizes. So, I'd mainly just stick with the #3 since it's the smallest/cheapest version. I've found that while I prefer a hook in the deadbolt locks, the half diamond pick seems to work better in padlocks for me so give that a try. Padlocks have a little different feel, but you'll get used to them. I would probably avoid raking at this point, it's more important to develop your feel for single pin picking. Raking sort of gives random results. It's got a finesse to it as well, but at our level you don't know what you're being rewarded for.

When you get good with that crop, the Master #140 is a step up and does contain a spool pin. The Master 40 discus lock shouldn't be that hard, but the wierd tension seems to make it a lot more challenging, I haven't gotten this one open yet.

[gf1984]

The new Defiant deadbolts I have seen have one spool pin. Every one I've taken apart (at least 10) the spool has been in position #3. The plug will start to turn then stop. If you let off tension a little bit and push this pin up again it will open. Hope this helps.

--Steve

[anoncoward]

...If you let off tension a little bit and push this pin up again it will open. Hope this helps.

--Steve

Thanks, I've tried that and it works. It slips a little and I have to redo a pin, but it does slide back without all the pins dropping back again. I also tried what you said about dropping the back pin to pull the plug. That was dead on, thanks. I'm going to make a plug follower tonight & check out the inside of this lock.

...Raking sort of gives random results. It's got a finesse to it as well, but at our level you don't know what you're being rewarded for....

Exactly! I feel like I don't know what I did to pick it, it was mostly an accident.

raimundo, I think I'll take your advice and try not to think about it while I'm raking the lock. I'll probably get more of a feel for it that way.

- Ed