locksmith lied to my dads face when i wasint there...

[josh0094]

so, my grandma resantly died so were up at her house in Washington state, her house is in the middle of no ware, and she never locks her doors, heck the lock on the front door didnt even work. but noone is going to be around for awile so we had to hire a locksmith,

pretty str8 forward job we needed done: all the locks rekeyed, deadbolt installed,

easy pleezy right? WRONG! so, he starts with the front door, took him about 15 mins to do that one,

next, he goes to the sidedoor, and explains that he will install the deadbolt later,so he starts to pick it, and *suposaly* the lock was sooo frozen that he would have to replace the whole knob,

then, the last door, the slider, he starts on that one... but the pins are so gummed up he cant pick it, so he desides that the job is undoable.

so heres the recap so far: 1 lock rekeyed, 1 doorknob replaced, 1 door *unfixable*

now i guess him and my dad are talking and my dad asks him what are the laws regarding lockpicks in Washington

and he says "they are ilegal"

so later my dad asks me, did you bring your picks with you? and i say yea,
and hes like there ilegal
and im like WTF! because i read online that only bump keys are ilegal in washington state,

so heres the next recap:
oh yeah he finished rekeying the 3rd door,
2 locks rekeyed, 1 doorknob replaced. 1 lie told. 1 job not done, 1 deadbolt installed

totall charge? $350! i wasint there to stop my dad, so he paid him and the locksmith left. is this a good price? seems a bit high to me!

not very impressed with the work, we had 3 keys made to fit the locks. only 2 of them work. the 3rd one u have to jiggle around.

J

[vrocco]

Couldn't talk your dad into letting you do it?

[JackNco]

if the locks went being used and had been that way for years theres a good chance they had got "gummed up". it could have made them very hard to pick even if the key was still working in the lock.

I'm amazed he didn't just replace all the locks on the spot to be honest.

The price sounds a bit steep but 2 trips out there. 2 new locks and a rekey its not that out there. I have heard of people being charged that for a single trip out there and to drill and replace a single lock. some of these guys are cowboys.

Personally I haven't read up on your local laws but if you were found picking locks it would make a B&E charge a lot worse. that might of been what he meant.

You may be more than capable of doing the job but at the same time an insurance claim wouldn't hold much water if it was uncovered that the owners 15YO did the work instead of a locksmith. in the same way that you may be able to service your own car but its worth more if it has a proper service history.

John

[freakparade3]

If she never used the locks on her doors it is entirely possible thay would not work properly. I would have taken the time to take them apart for cleaning but most locksmiths are not going to do that. Time is money. It was probably cheaper for your dad to replace the lock rather than pay a locksmiths hourly wage to clean the old one. As for the total price, it seems high to me but I don't know what type of locks they were or the average price for locksmiths in your area.

[globallockytoo]

If she never used the locks on her doors it is entirely possible thay would not work properly. I would have taken the time to take them apart for cleaning but most locksmiths are not going to do that. Time is money. It was probably cheaper for your dad to replace the lock rather than pay a locksmiths hourly wage to clean the old one. As for the total price, it seems high to me but I don't know what type of locks they were or the average price for locksmiths in your area.

ditto!


Were you quoted in advance of the job being done?

If not, why not?

The economy in different places dictate different prices. How long was the locksmith there altogether?

A grade 2 entrance lock could cost as much as $95.00. A deadbolt that is also grade 2 will cost at least $70 depending on brand.

Rekeying cylinders averages about $10 each. Sounds like he had to replace they cylinder in the Slider, so thats probably another $25.

Say 3 hours labor on site and a service call....adds up pretty close to $350.00

I think the price is not that unfair.
As to the laws.....True he might not know the laws...but why would he tell the client something to make them feel anything but secure? He might be wanting to reassure people.

[dougfarre]

Hobbiests always seem quite traumatized after an experience with a locksmith. Just like in any other trade.
" Dude, I waited two weeks for the cable company to come fix my cable, just so they could open the box and re-connect a wire! Then they charged me $100. "

Same old.

[maintenanceguy]

Most people that have never had their own business don't know what it costs to run one. I came up with the following list several years ago when I had mine. I'm sure many of these costs have gone up.

Operating costs for a one man operation. Note, these are "real" costs:
1. A good family medical program - $700 per month minimum.
2. Vehicle, gas, ins., payments, depreciation, tires, tune up, repairs, etc. - $670
3. Office supplies including stamps - $30
4. Acct and attorney, if and when needed - $50
5. Magzines and books $40
6. Business taxes - $100
7. Telephone - $50
8. Cellular phone - $100
9. Travel & entertainment - $50
10. Seminars and Trade Shows - $125
11. Uniforms - even just jeans and shirts - $45
12. Small tools - $15
13. Software and upgrades - $30
14. Marketing & Advertising - $200
15. Office Equipment depreciation - $75
16. Liability Insurance - $300
17. Workers Comp OR Disability insurance - $125
18. Bad Debt - $100
19. Guarantee work $100
20. Future Capital Expenditures - $100
21. Owners draw ($1000 weekly) - $4333.00
22. Bookkeeping - ($150 per week) $650

With no provisions for retirement, no paid vacation pay, no paid sick time, no other perks and benefits a real job gets you, it comes to about $7950 per month. Divide that by about an average of 32 "production" hours per week at 46 weeks for a total of 1472 man hours per year, or about 122 man hours per month. Divide that $7950 by the 122 hours and you get $65 per hour - COST of doing business. Add the profit you want.

If this guy had to make two trips, I don't think anyone got ripped off. But if the guy didn't do the work well, you should have him back out to do it right. You probably paid a fair price and you deserve quality work.

[Beyond]

Service charges are the biggest net profit for the locksmith, dollar for dollar. Parts offer some profit. Labor a lot more. But just driving out to the job is where the locksmith makes the biggest profit, dollar for dollar.

[raimundo]

legal advice from a locksmith is like legal advice from a cop. repressive,untrue and unlikely to respect your rights. there are a lot more people who will tell you the law is whatever serves their predjudices, you need to learn to use a law library, even with a lawyer, you will just get bushit if you don't look up statute law and research case law. there should be a law library at the county courthouse or at any university law school near you. the current statutes will be a large set of books, look for the index which is a separate book, probably with a few bound pages inserted concerning changes in the law since the books were published. Here you can find the applicable statute, then you need to look for the case law, which are precedents set when cases were decided in the past. All this should be available in a law library.

[globallockytoo]

Service charges are the biggest net profit for the locksmith, dollar for dollar. Parts offer some profit. Labor a lot more. But just driving out to the job is where the locksmith makes the biggest profit, dollar for dollar.

i'm not sure i agree completely.
I always thought the service charge was designed to pay for the items like, insurance, registration, fuel, phone, advertising/marketing etc. but broken down over the quantity of jobs done.

As overheads increase, so too do service calls (sometimes)
Many people dont really understand the purpose of the service call and therefore make claims like Beyond above. Realistically, there is no profit in a service call....mostly a loss...but sometimes basic initial costs.

example.....I worked out that the average cost for me to get jobs, including advertising/marketing, telephone, stationary, business cards, postage registration, insurance, fuel, maintenance etc.....per job...works out to between $7.50 and $15.00 average per job. Now, taking into consideration all my other overheads, I would need to charge $45-$55 call out......I dont. I started business only 3 months ago and set my call out at $45 including the 1st half hour labor. When you consider that I charge $60 per hour labor, this is interpreted as $15.00 to come out and $30 for the 1st half hour labor. Effectively covering my basic costs. As my business grows in size and in staff, the need to increase the service call will increase too....to effectively cover initial costs in getting jobs.

Understand?

[Beyond]

i'm not sure i agree completely.
I always thought the service charge was designed to pay for the items like, insurance, registration, fuel, phone, advertising/marketing etc. but broken down over the quantity of jobs done.

Aren't all profits though?

Service calls aren't separated from the rest of the profits and taken to pay for everything else. All profits are collected and paid out from there, usually. If you want to be specific, I can back out costs from labor or parts and explain that those are used to recoup company expenses. More than one way to skin a cat.

I'm not speaking on what gets separated out to pay a,b, and c. I was saying it was their biggest profit dollar for dollar. If my company drives 5 seconds or 5 miles out, the amount is always the same.

As overheads increase, so too do service calls (sometimes)
Many people dont really understand the purpose of the service call and therefore make claims like Beyond above.

What are you talking about?

A service call is meant to compensate for at least taking the time of the tech/locksmith to come out there and see what needs to be done. Labor, parts, etc. are determined from there.

Realistically, there is no profit in a service call....mostly a loss...but sometimes basic initial costs.

That's totally false. My company operates out of one of the largest cities in the U.S. Most of clients are within a 0-5 mile range. You can't tell me we're not making profit just by driving a few blocks down the street to look at a problem. On top of that, we charge for whatever services we render.

And like I said, given time, resources, effort, service calls net the most profit dollar for dollar than any other task by a locksmith.

example.....I worked out that the average cost for me to get jobs, including advertising/marketing, telephone, stationary, business cards, postage registration, insurance, fuel, maintenance etc.....per job...works out to between $7.50 and $15.00 average per job. Now, taking into consideration all my other overheads, I would need to charge $45-$55 call out......I dont. I started business only 3 months ago and set my call out at $45 including the 1st half hour labor. When you consider that I charge $60 per hour labor, this is interpreted as $15.00 to come out and $30 for the 1st half hour labor. Effectively covering my basic costs. As my business grows in size and in staff, the need to increase the service call will increase too....to effectively cover initial costs in getting jobs.

Understand?

You're bundling all of that into service call profits. What do you bundle in profits made off of labor? Or parts?

You can selectively choose what you want to pay profits with to change the circumstances of any business.

[gostone]

globallockytoo wrote,

A deadbolt that is also grade 2 will cost at least $70 depending on brand.

Maybe you should look for some better deals, I buy decent grade 2 cylinders for $25.00.

Realistically, there is no profit in a service call....mostly a loss...but sometimes basic initial costs.

Well if you are in a service business, and going in at a loss on your service, you won't be servicing for long, or won't be able to afford to work for long.

I would need to charge $45-$55 call out......I dont. I started business only 3 months ago and set my call out at $45 including the 1st half hour labor

I do locksmithing as a sideline, and make a decent full time living, but I could not afford to do service call outs at $45-$55 for a call out. Even at my lowest call out for a lockout in my neighbourhood of $60.00 just to arrive, I am still low. One of the lockout calls I did last weekend, the guy was grateful I charged $60 for a lockout, as the next price was quoted @ $150.......

best of luck[/quote]

[Beyond]

Service charges are the biggest net profit for the locksmith, dollar for dollar. Parts offer some profit. Labor a lot more. But just driving out to the job is where the locksmith makes the biggest profit, dollar for dollar.

i'm not sure i agree completely.
I always thought the service charge was designed to pay for the items like, insurance, registration, fuel, phone, advertising/marketing etc. but broken down over the quantity of jobs done.

As overheads increase, so too do service calls (sometimes)
Many people dont really understand the purpose of the service call and therefore make claims like Beyond above. Realistically, there is no profit in a service call....mostly a loss...but sometimes basic initial costs.

example.....I worked out that the average cost for me to get jobs, including advertising/marketing, telephone, stationary, business cards, postage registration, insurance, fuel, maintenance etc.....per job...works out to between $7.50 and $15.00 average per job. Now, taking into consideration all my other overheads, I would need to charge $45-$55 call out......I dont. I started business only 3 months ago and set my call out at $45 including the 1st half hour labor. When you consider that I charge $60 per hour labor, this is interpreted as $15.00 to come out and $30 for the 1st half hour labor. Effectively covering my basic costs. As my business grows in size and in staff, the need to increase the service call will increase too....to effectively cover initial costs in getting jobs.

Understand?

For what it's worth, other member's view on globallockytoo:

Rai,

I know globallocky from another site. Don't pay any attention to him 'cause all he is is a jerk wanting to be contrary with anyone and everyone.

He just thinks he's a locksmith.

I wonder what he means by that last line.

[josh0094]

okay well.. jobs all done. what can you do. Ive only ever talked to 2 locksmith about picking locks, the first one thought it was pretty cool, this one not so much...

he didnt clean his wood shavings from the door...

not to mention im missing school today because were snowed in that makes me kinda happy. oh well.

i guess its said and done. but i think next time ill go with sombody else...

[WOT]

I'm with you his language may not have been precise, but "unfixable" usually means "not commercially feasible". Sort of like a vehicle with $7,000 damage retail cost that's worth $5,000 whole sale.