Help please I'm locked In/Out

[Scooby]

I'm a complete newbie to locks but have a problem with my own back door. The lock has jammed. I wasn't sure if it had jammed locked or unlock. Its a double glazed UPVC door with additional bolts around the door. I have the key but the barrel wouldn't turn.

I was completely stuck last night and jumped in with both feet and have probably made things worse. I've now drilled out the pins below the barrel and completely removed the euro cylinder.

The door is still locked, I've managed using a small inspection mirror to look inside the lock and noticed two brass sections above. One appear to want to move sideways away from the lock, the other could move up and down. The sideways one wouldn't move on its own but looked like if I operated the up and down one first it would move. So I thought this would unlock the door. I managed to insert a couple of angled tools and operate both at the same and I heard a click as the sideways one operated. The door is still locked. I then noticed via the mirror looking to the side that another steel section had moved. I think this could be the actual door bolt which has moved the opposite way to the direction I moved the brass sideways thing. I think the steel bit has now locked the door. I have tried moving everything I can think of to move the brass bit back but it now won't budge.

I suspect the original fault with the door was the additional bolts in the top and bottom hadn't released and the doors main lock was probably already unlocked. I'm not sure why the key wouldn't turn originally but I think I've now managed to lock it.

Any ideas how I can get the door open.

Thanks

[pinky]

if its a standard upvc door, then try using a flat screw driver, insert and lift the single lever then slide back the bolt, if handles on r/h side of door angle screwdriver up at 1 o clock push lever up and flick bolt back to 11 o clock, if lock on l/h side of door then aim up at 11 and flick to 1 o clock

[Scooby]

I'm working from inside of the house and the door lock is on the right had side of the door.

Originally the brass section was at 1 O'Clock position and by pushing up on the other peice of brass I was able to move the first brass section to 11 O'Clock position, but this seems to have move the actual door bolt into the frame. The section I pushed up is now still up and won't come back down and I can't move the bit at 11 O'Clock back to the 1 O'Clock position.

(I've been called into work at the moment so I'm not currently at home to look back at the door)

Thanks for your help so far.

[toomush2drink]

I did a lock like this the other week and it is the mechanism thats seized. You need to do as pinky described above before you can do anything else. Think about how its works as you have taken out the lock and can see its only operated by a plastic cam.

If you get it open remove the whole multipoint mechanism and see where its seized. The one the other week was quite old and basically needed cleaning up and a good lubrication to free it all up. When ou get it out you will see the multipoint works by sliding up a plate with the bolts attached which can seize.

When you replace the euro think about fitting a thumbturn in case it happens again as this will give you more leverage.

[Scooby]

Thanks Guys,

I've now managed to open the door, the handle feels as though its catching something when pushing down to open the door now. It feels like it stops then starts again. I guess this was the root cause of the problem. I suspect the euro cylinder was fine but this other problem had jammed it up.

Do I now need to remove the whole lock assemble from the side of the door ? Excuse my ignorance, I've really no idea what I'm doing.

looking at the side of the door I can see a metal plate with a load of screws all the way up the door.

[toomush2drink]

Your right about all the screws, undo them all and before you take out the last one see if you can insert a thin screwdrier or rod into one of the screw holes. Sometimes inside the frame of the door is a metal plate for the screws to bite into and it can drop down meaning you have to drill new holes. One way to avoid this is to pull out the mechanism at the top and put your screwdriver in the screw hole on the door (not through the locking mechanism itself) then remove the last screw at the bottom and remove, this should prevent it falling down.
Not all have this its just a precaution.

Take out the mechanism and if you can take photos with a digital before you strip it down as these can prove a handy reference if something drops out etc. Lubricate the sliding strips the bolts are on and the lock itself and you should be ok.

Like metioned before a thumbturn euro cylinder may be more appropiate in case it seizes again as you have the option of turning it with some pliers before you have to drill it out.

[pinky]

its worth remembering that all final points of exit should have thumb turns and especially if only 1 point of exit, in this case its now a legality for fire regs.

[toomush2drink]

With the fire regulations does this apply when replacing a lock or on newly built houses only ?

[pinky]

on replacement you should fit a thumb turn , though it would be hard to prove negligence upon your part , as long as you advise to fit and offer to fit a thumb turn, in a rented property it would be the landlords responsibility and on a private property the owners, though you should at least offer and advise.

possibly in the event of fire and death you may face at least partial liability.

enviromental health have a budget to change many properties to thumb turn or similar, well worth contacting them.

[Scooby]

I've not had chance to strip the door down yet. I'm glad I waited now some handy tips there that will no doubt save me a lot of heart ache.

I had no idea about the fire regs. Personally I would prefer the door to be locked via a key. If someone did happen to break in through a window or something then having locked doors would be a lot more secure.

I will look into replacing the euro with a thumb one. An internet friend who is a builder had some locks in his van and offered to send me one, he also suggested the thumb one. I said what every was easiest for him so hopefully it was a thumb one he sent. They should arrive in the morning

Thanks for your help guys.

[toomush2drink]

i used to think like that about the thumb turn but as long as you dont use it next to letterbox you should be ok. I think long the lines of if they have got in they can get out.

[jason]

If you do have the lock next to a letterbox put a basket over it (to catch post) it makes it a little harder to use a letterbox kit.

With regards to local authority grant budgets - some will only consider the change to thumb turns on multi-occupied properties - others work through a "safe as houses" scheme for the elderly - I know where I work they prefer to do it in house (they charge the elderly £5 per hour and claim the rest of the money back through internal transfer - no way can a trading locksmith match that!).