Lock Picking 101 Forum
A community dedicated to the fun and ethical hobby of lock picking.
       

Lock Picking 101 Home
Login
Profile
Members
Forum Rules
Frequent Forum Questions
SEARCH
View New Posts
View Active Topics


Live Chat on Discord
LP101 Forum Chat
Keypicking Forum Chat
Reddit r/lockpicking Chat



Learn How to Pick Locks
FAQs & General Questions
Got Beginner Questions?
Pick-Fu [Intermediate Level]


Ask a Locksmith
This Old Lock
This Old Safe
What Lock Should I Buy?



Hardware
Locks
Lock Patents
Lock Picks
Lock Bumping
Lock Impressioning
Lock Pick Guns, Snappers
European Locks & Picks
The Machine Shop
The Open Source Lock
Handcuffs


Member Spotlight
Member Introductions
Member Lock Collections
Member Social Media


Off Topic
General Chatter
Other Puzzles


Locksmith Business Info
Training & Licensing
Running a Business
Keyways & Key Blanks
Key Machines
Master Keyed Systems
Closers and Crash Bars
Life Safety Compliance
Electronic Locks & Access
Locksmith Supplies
Locksmith Lounge


Buy Sell Trade
Buy - Sell - Trade
It came from Ebay!


Advanced Topics
Membership Information
Special Access Required:
High Security Locks
Vending Locks
Advanced Lock Pick Tools
Bypass Techniques
Safes & Safe Locks
Automotive Entry & Tools
Advanced Buy/Sell/Trade


Locksport Groups
Locksport Local
Chapter President's Office
Locksport Board Room
 

Amazing lock

Information about locks themselves. Questions, tips and lock diagram information should be posted here.

Re: Amazing lock

Postby ridinplugspinnaz » 7 Dec 2008 12:24

n2oah wrote:
Major Boothroyd wrote:Honestly, the alpha spring just seems like a waste. I'm assuming every one of them pushes up the pin to the exact same distance and when that's figured out you might as well just drill a hole into a regular key and that's it.


Like someone else said previously, the alpha spring is simply for patent protection, as well as a "coolness" factor. I guess when you name parts of your lock with Greek letters, it makes your lock sound better.


Although this didn't occur to me earlier, the so-called "alpha spring" does actually serve a purpose other than patent protection. In this particular case, putting in an "active" element in the key like the "alpha spring" in the MT5 provides effective countermeasure against unauthorized key duplication by casting, which is an attack vector that even many high-security locks are still susceptible to. Barry and Han from TOOOL gave an excellent talk on the subject at The Last HOPE.

So yeah, I still think it's a gimmicky addition, and probably one that's prone to break prematurely, but whether or not it was intended, it does make unauthorized key duplication much harder. In fact, due to the design of the spring, you're likely going to screw up the key itself if you try to cast it!
ridinplugspinnaz
 
Posts: 279
Joined: 4 Aug 2008 2:43

Re: Amazing lock

Postby n2oah » 8 Dec 2008 20:59

ridinplugspinnaz wrote:Although this didn't occur to me earlier, the so-called "alpha spring" does actually serve a purpose other than patent protection. In this particular case, putting in an "active" element in the key like the "alpha spring" in the MT5 provides effective countermeasure against unauthorized key duplication by casting, which is an attack vector that even many high-security locks are still susceptible to.


Good call! I didn't even think about that!
"Lockpicking is what robbing is all about!" says Jim King.
n2oah
 
Posts: 3180
Joined: 13 May 2005 22:03
Location: Menomonie, WI, USA

Re: Amazing lock

Postby J-Hood » 8 Dec 2008 23:01

I assume the sidebar cuts will be unique to individual locksmiths and the variance will make it harder to design a pick tool like the one for the previous version that just plain killed that one.
J-Hood
 
Posts: 65
Joined: 2 Apr 2008 2:24
Location: Chicago

Re: Amazing lock

Postby n2oah » 8 Dec 2008 23:24

J-Hood wrote:I assume the sidebar cuts will be unique to individual locksmiths and the variance will make it harder to design a pick tool like the one for the previous version that just plain killed that one.


I really doubt it will vary with every locksmith. It will most likely vary by region, except for large dealers and special institutions.
"Lockpicking is what robbing is all about!" says Jim King.
n2oah
 
Posts: 3180
Joined: 13 May 2005 22:03
Location: Menomonie, WI, USA

Re: Amazing lock

Postby J-Hood » 9 Dec 2008 1:17

Well I guess that will depend on how many combinations it allows and how many locksmiths carry it. And then you would have to take the company's desire to suppply the best product versus their convience to produce product into account. So who knows how many useable combinations versus actual used combos there will be... :roll:

Jason
J-Hood
 
Posts: 65
Joined: 2 Apr 2008 2:24
Location: Chicago

Previous

Return to Locks

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 6 guests