help with a master lock spool pins?

[hillbilly21]

hey i'm havin real problems with a master lock it has the spool pins in it and i know that you use less tesion to get past them. ( i think) but its the last two pins in the very back i cant get. but any ideas or tips would be apperciated. thanks cody

[MacGnG1]

pick the lock to a false set, slightly release tension and gently pick the pin that you got the lock to false set with. check out some of the videos on you tube about security pins, those helped me

[hillbilly21]

alrighty man will do thanks alot..

[le.nutzman]

hey i'm havin real problems with a master lock it has the spool pins in it and i know that you use less tesion to get past them. ( i think) but its the last two pins in the very back i cant get. but any ideas or tips would be apperciated. thanks cody

A spool pin is a spool pin is a spool pin, learn to identify and pick them in any lock and you will be better for having done so. Picking spool pins in a Masterlock is no different then picking them in an American 5200 Padlock, it's still a spool pin.

Use light tension, when you feel the over exagerated forward movement of the plug you've reached a false set, let up lightly but maintain constant tension and continue lifting falsely set pin. It will produce counter rotation on your tension wrench and then will lurch forward moderately, this is caused by the binding point on that pin moving from the thinner inner body of the spool pin out and over the lip of the end of the pin. The spool pin is now set correctly.

The above process is the way to defeat spool pins in pretty much any aspect. A couple things to keep in mind tho, if you know you're dealing with more than one spool pin, setting it correctly MAY cause other pins to become UNSET. Rule of thumb in the case of picking locks with security pins is to identify the security pins and pick them FIRST. In the case of a lock that has all security pins, it's just a matter of trial and error. Secondly, the counter rotation of your tension wrench when setting spool pins is NORMAL, do not question it or yourself because the amount of counter rotation to set a spool pin is nominally enough that you only notice it's happening but nothing more. HOWEVER, if you have previously set a normal pin and then attempt to set a spool pin you WILL unset the normal pin in MOST cases, again refer back to rule of thumb. Hope this helps.

[zeke79]

Great description there Le. I could not have posted it better myself. After you accomplish it once, practice practice practice. Then buy more locks with spool pins. Preferably locks with better tolerances to increase your picking skills .

[hillbilly21]

alrighty like zeke said very nice description.. now easier said than done haha well for me it is but thanks again!! cody

[apb]

Here's a link to an animation of whats going on with the spool pin in the lock. You can see how the plug starts to rotate in the other direction when its almost picked. I can't remember for the life of me where I found this video, other wise I'd give some credit.



http://s298.photobucket.com/albums/mm26 ... imatio.flv

[hillbilly21]

sorry i got confused in the begin and i said it was master lock its a brinks. but that all you guys for helpin me out. i did some reasearch and alot of people said its a really hard lock to pick and you really cant false set it. but so i'm going to leave that one alone and i got another lock. a master lock number three and work my way up. any advice for the next lock maybe a beginers lock for spool or other "anti picking locks"? thanks cody

[zeke79]

Try picking up a kwikset deadbolt keyed both sides. Leave one as is and key the other one up with some spool pins. Once you have that down, key it up with a mix of spool and serrated pins.

Do you have a kwikset deadbolt yet? If so, drop me a pm and I might be able to help you out sourcing some security pins, and possibly some progressively harder bottom pins and cut keys.

[ridinplugspinnaz]

Forgive me for bumping a somewhat older thread, but I just picked my first lock with security pins! I'd put down picking for awhile, but decided to come back to it for the break. After cracking open a half dozen Master #3s, I decided to try to tackle some of my harder locks, including my first with security pins.

Anyway, I just have to say that i.e.nutzman's description of how to tackle spools was immensely helpful... his description of what I should be feeling with the tension wrench as I lifted the spools from their false sets was exactly spot on. After getting frustrated with the lock, I came on to LP101 specifically to search for old threads with advice on spools, and the next thing I knew, I had this little Brinks brass padlock open within 5 minutes of reading that post.

So yeah, good on you nutzman, and if I do say so myself, good on me for finally opening a lock with security pins! Given that there's no one around here that can appreciate that, I had to tell someone, at least...

[kaiga]

So if I have a lock with all spools when i set one, then i set another then the first one drops and I try to set another and the second one i set drops. is this normal?

[Jaakko]

So if I have a lock with all spools when i set one, then i set another then the first one drops and I try to set another and the second one i set drops. is this normal?

Yes, it perfectly normal and it is usually called frustration.

[le.nutzman]

So if I have a lock with all spools when i set one, then i set another then the first one drops and I try to set another and the second one i set drops. is this normal?

Yes, it perfectly normal and it is usually called frustration.

It's normal, and I have pinned American 5200 padlocks with all 5 spool pins and let me tell you, it was the first and last time I'd ever do that. What you now have to figure out is exactly what order the spool pins have to be set in. Any other order than the correct order and you'll experience exactly what you posted, just means you're not setting the pins in the correct order. Took me all of about 3 days to pick my first all spool pin lock.

Something to keep in mind though, if you repinned the lock this way, if you can remember the order in which you had to pick it prior to repinning it, this doesn't change because you changed the pins TO THE EXTENT that the original picking order remains the same due to the way the plug was originally drilled at the manufacturer. What DOES change is how often the binding pin will change because you have increased the number of "catch" points by using spool pins instead of regular pins.

[ridinplugspinnaz]

It's normal, and I have pinned American 5200 padlocks with all 5 spool pins and let me tell you, it was the first and last time I'd ever do that. What you now have to figure out is exactly what order the spool pins have to be set in. Any other order than the correct order and you'll experience exactly what you posted, just means you're not setting the pins in the correct order. Took me all of about 3 days to pick my first all spool pin lock.

Something to keep in mind though, if you repinned the lock this way, if you can remember the order in which you had to pick it prior to repinning it, this doesn't change because you changed the pins TO THE EXTENT that the original picking order remains the same due to the way the plug was originally drilled at the manufacturer. What DOES change is how often the binding pin will change because you have increased the number of "catch" points by using spool pins instead of regular pins.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it generally common practice (at least from the factory) to pin locks with at least one standard driver instead of all spools? The reason being, I believe, is to prevent unintended turning of the plug when inserting the key... if the plug could turn a bit, that would catch some spools on the lip of the shear line, which would prevent the key from going in any further, or in the worst case, dent the key or the pins themselves. So in the "real world", you shouldn't encounter any locks with all spools, right?

I can totally see why you'd want to pin a lock as all spools though, I bet that is a crazy picking exercise to get hone your skills on.

[Olson Burry]

RPS: Yes I would say you are correct that you wouldn't find a lock with all security pins in. In my experience the first pin is usually a normal one with the security pins all behind that if they are there.