EVIL profile cylinder from Union... any info on these?

[Solomon]

Hey guys, this came in the post today and I'm having a real rough time getting it picked. First and foremost, does anyone know what type of pins are in these? I'd look for myself, but I have no idea how to repin euro profiles and I can never get circlips back on neatly so I try to avoid it. I'm not getting a lot of feedback from the pins, but what I can tell you is that I haven't managed to set any properly yet. That, or I can't feel it happening - which is possible since they're easily overset, thus the tolerances are fairly high. Here come the pretty pictures:





Pretty cool, right? I've never seen a black cylinder before, so I just had to have it. I actually expected it to be a nice easy pick, but it's definately putting up a fight so far. There's something interesting about this which I haven't encountered before, maybe someone can help me out with this... when the key is inserted, it turns a slight amount (about 5-10 degrees) then stops. It won't turn smoothly past this point with light force like normal. You need to turn a bit heavier till it clicks past that stopping point, or push the key forwards in order to get it to turn properly. It's fine once you get it past that little sticking point though.

I lined the keys up with the bottom of the cylinder and everything is aligned correctly, so why is it behaving like this? I'm guessing it's something to do with the shear line, maybe the top of the plug is filed flat and the drivers are catching on it or something along those lines. Whatever it is, when it comes to picking, it means once all the pins are set I'll need to up the tension a lot to get the plug to actually rotate past the sticky bit... this is a problem since the feedback isn't the best, but I'll crack it eventually. Maybe after sandwiches.

Anyone had a lock that behaved like this before?

[mhole]

That's a union Monarch cylinder, probably a good few years old since they were used on euro profile deadlocks on aluminium doors made for a fairly short period in the 80s, which were rendered obsolete by the introduction of UPVC.

That design of cylinder can be a PITA to strip down, since they use a non-standard surclip design. You need to knock out the little roll pin which passes through the cam and both surclips, then you can rotate the surclips and pop them off with a small screwdriver.

I haven't had one to bits for a while, but I don't remember anything unusual, except unions normal counterbore around the pin holes.

[Solomon]

That's a union Monarch cylinder, probably a good few years old since they were used on euro profile deadlocks on aluminium doors made for a fairly short period in the 80s, which were rendered obsolete by the introduction of UPVC.

That design of cylinder can be a PITA to strip down, since they use a non-standard surclip design. You need to knock out the little roll pin which passes through the cam and both surclips, then you can rotate the surclips and pop them off with a small screwdriver.

I haven't had one to bits for a while, but I don't remember anything unusual, except unions normal counterbore around the pin holes.

That's some good info right there, just what I was looking for! I'm gonna look and see what else I can find on these, as they're quite interesting. Now that I know what the "M" stands for, I can hopefully dig up some stuff.

Interesting you should mention that roll pin, you must be pretty familiar with these... I noticed that and was wondering what it was for, care to fill me in on that? When I look at the top of the cylinder I can see it shifting from one side to the other when I angle it back and forth, so it must be something do do with how the key engages the cam but besides that I have no real idea.

As for the counterbore, maybe that's why it's sticking the way it is, but I'm not sure... the Union rim cylinder I have is made the same way and doesn't behave like this.

Regardless, I figured out a little trick to getting it picked... when you get the key past that little sticky bit, and rotate it back past the 12 o'clock mark, it actually glides past quite smoothly. It only sticks when you have the key at the 12 o'clock mark itself and start to rotate it from there. Hopefully that makes sense! With that in mind, what I did was set a couple of pins CCW (as the feedback is better that way) then change tension direction quickly to CW. Same idea as a plug spinner, but with your fingers... obviously the pins don't stay set like they would with a plug spinner, but it does catch them and alleviate the problem somehow, allowing it to be picked as normal.



I actually figured this out a litle while after those sandwiches I mentioned, but didn't want to double post.