Found a Major floor safe

[item9]

Hey Guys,

I've been doing quite a bit of remodeling in my home, which I purchased two years ago, and stumbled across a floor safe under some carpeting in the basement. The safe was of course locked.

The manufacturer is Major, in Los Angeles, CA. The serial # is readable, so I called Major, now owned by another company. They said they had the original combination on file when the safe was manufactured and would be able to provide the combination to a properly licensed locksmith.

I have contacted a local locksmith, who would be happy to do this for only $20. With the recent holidays I have yet to get this completed, but I am very skeptical that this combination they have on file would even work. I am sure whoever installed this safe years, maybe even decades, ago must have changed the combination.

Since discovering this safe, my family, friends, and relatives have been going nuts with theories. I've been doing a lot of research on how I might go about opening this thing on my own, as I love projects / mysteries like this.

I came across your website, which I've found fascinating by the way. I thought you guys may be able to help. I've attempted to attach a photo of the safe, the way I discovered it, with this message. I hope it worked.

I've had the patience to open cheesy stuff like bike locks in the past. I've also learned the mathematics behind opening Master combination locks. All minor-league stuff for you guys, I'm sure.

So here's the question.... Can a complete amateur like myself open a floor safe like this?

Thanks,

item9

[mcm757207]

In all seriousness, probably not. Without looking up that particular model and based just off the photo you posted, it looks like an S&G 6730 lock which can certainly be manipulated. However it is far different from master lock combination locks or bike locks which rely on logic to crack. Rather, locks like this require both logic and a developed skill which takes lots of practice. I would say drop the $20 and see if the combination works-- there's a good chance it does.

If you were really willing to spend a lot of time practicing trying to open this, take a look at Matt Blaze's paper on safe cracking for the computer scientist. Don't get your hopes up though.

[item9]

Thanks for the quick response.

I followed your suggestion and found Matt Blaze's paper and printed all 34 pages. I'll read it tonight.

I am definitely going to pay the local locksmith the $20 to get the original combination for me. My friends and family want to have a 'safe opening' party to see if it can be opened. Whatever.

If we can open it, I am doubtful anything would be in it. I just want to open the safe and maintain it as part of the history of an old house.

Curious though, what makes you think the original combination would still work? Has it been your experience that people who purchase / install these floor safes don't change the combination?

Does it require a special skill / ability to change the combination?

As for a Sargent & Greenleaf lock, it is. Don't know if it's a #6730, but you sound like you would know. Any idea how old this thing could be? Maybe from the 1970's or 80's?

Thanks again for your input,

item9

[Eyes_Only]

Actually yes, many owners of safes neglect to change the combo from the factory one it came with. When I went on a couple of safe jobs we tried the factory combo first a lot of times before the drill and scope came out.

[mcm757207]

Many safes are shipped with a "real" combination from the factory. Unlike computers where the default password might be "password", many safes are shipped with unique combinations such as 22-67-40; although there are some that are set to combinations like 25-50-25 or 50-75-50. And yes, a locksmith would have had to come out and change the combination, it's not something the safe owner likely knew how to do or had the tools to do. I'd say 80 or 90% chance the combination hasn't been changed.

[item9]

Eyes_Only and mcm757207

Thanks to both you guys. Once I get that original combination from my local locksmith, I'll be sure to let you guys know if it works. In the meantime it's been a lot of fun learning about all of this.

[Raymond]

Interestingly enough, it is true that many people who buy a safe never change the combination. Almost ALL new safes come with the change key and instructions for changing the combo. However I am called out many times each week to just change the combo and the person in charge of the safe does not want the responsibility of doing the change. They would rather have the expert change it.

Bottom line - there is a great chance that the factory combo will still work. Also have you spent any time tracking down the previous owners of the house to see if they remember the combo or if not whether it had been changed? This is worth the trouble before you pay anything.

I none of these possibilities work you can call a locksmith to drill it open.

[Josh K]

I'm curious, what would the the cost for having someone come out and opening in a NDE way? I'm thinking that safe's aren't all the cheap, and it'd be pretty cool to have one stuck in your floor, even if all you keep in there is a bottle of scotch and some glasses.

[ElAbogado]

I'm curious, what would the the cost for having someone come out and opening in a NDE way? I'm thinking that safe's aren't all the cheap, and it'd be pretty cool to have one stuck in your floor, even if all you keep in there is a bottle of scotch and some glasses.

Drilling is not destructive. A 1/4 inch hole is made under the dial and then plugged with a hardened ball bearing that is welded from the rear and filled from the front. Stronger than before if done correctly.

It would be better to have someone manipulate the lock open, but most safe guys don't want to bother with that because quite frankly, they aren't well trained in manipulation. A standard 6730 should open in less than an hour if it give good drop in point readings.

Either way, you will have a good serviceable B rated floor safe when you are done

[Josh K]

Drilling is not destructive. A 1/4 inch hole is made under the dial and then plugged with a hardened ball bearing that is welded from the rear and filled from the front. Stronger than before if done correctly.

It would be better to have someone manipulate the lock open, but most safe guys don't want to bother with that because quite frankly, they aren't well trained in manipulation. A standard 6730 should open in less than an hour if it give good drop in point readings.

Either way, you will have a good serviceable B rated floor safe when you are done

Ah, I guess the could be done. Might not look all that pretty, but should work fine. Let us know how it turns out!

[mcm757207]

Drilling is not destructive. A 1/4 inch hole is made under the dial and then plugged with a hardened ball bearing that is welded from the rear and filled from the front. Stronger than before if done correctly.

It would be better to have someone manipulate the lock open, but most safe guys don't want to bother with that because quite frankly, they aren't well trained in manipulation. A standard 6730 should open in less than an hour if it give good drop in point readings.

Either way, you will have a good serviceable B rated floor safe when you are done

Ah, I guess the could be done. Might not look all that pretty, but should work fine. Let us know how it turns out!

Sure it would look "pretty" - you would have no idea it was drilled. Unless you have Xray vision or completely or take the lock off.

[ElAbogado]

Drilling is not destructive. A 1/4 inch hole is made under the dial and then plugged with a hardened ball bearing that is welded from the rear and filled from the front. Stronger than before if done correctly.

It would be better to have someone manipulate the lock open, but most safe guys don't want to bother with that because quite frankly, they aren't well trained in manipulation. A standard 6730 should open in less than an hour if it give good drop in point readings.

Either way, you will have a good serviceable B rated floor safe when you are done

Ah, I guess the could be done. Might not look all that pretty, but should work fine. Let us know how it turns out!

The dial is removed from the spindle with a puller prior to drilling. You see nothing when it is repaired, as the work is done UNDER the dial. Visualize what I wrote before....

[Josh K]

Drilling is not destructive. A 1/4 inch hole is made under the dial and then plugged with a hardened ball bearing that is welded from the rear and filled from the front. Stronger than before if done correctly.

It would be better to have someone manipulate the lock open, but most safe guys don't want to bother with that because quite frankly, they aren't well trained in manipulation. A standard 6730 should open in less than an hour if it give good drop in point readings.

Either way, you will have a good serviceable B rated floor safe when you are done

Ah, I guess the could be done. Might not look all that pretty, but should work fine. Let us know how it turns out!

The dial is removed from the spindle with a puller prior to drilling. You see nothing when it is repaired, as the work is done UNDER the dial. Visualize what I wrote before....

I read "under the dial" as under the dial, not actually under the dial in a 3D sense.

[liza_normal]

Hi! Thank you for posting this-- we just found ourselves in the same situation today. How did it end up working out for you? Any way you could help me figure out the manufacturer number you called for Major? Thank you!

[Squelchtone]

Hi! Thank you for posting this-- we just found ourselves in the same situation today. How did it end up working out for you? Any way you could help me figure out the manufacturer number you called for Major? Thank you!

Please call American Security (AMSEC) in California, their number is at the very bottom of this link:
http://www.amsecusa.com/Floor_Safes/Maj ... loor_Safe/

They may send you to an authorized locksmith or safe tech in your area.

Hope that helps,
Squelchtone