ACE Hardware padlock...owning me

[theTastyCat]

Thanks, Squelch - I'll give it a shot! I've been wondering what that s-rake is for - thought it might be a Bogota knockoff.

[theTastyCat]

K, I'm retarded. Squelch, I'm not questioning your advice at all, I just can't get anywhere with it. Just to clarify, "applying more rotational force" is the same as increasing tension, right?

I am happy to accept that this lock is beyond me at present - someday I'll open the sucker. It's just frustrating to not be able to get anything to happen in the lock - I can either bind or more likely overset only one pin - nothing else will play ball. Thanks for all the good advice - maybe after I conquer a few more locks I'll have more luck with this one.

[chriswingate]

Yes, more rotational force, is the same as more tension.

[RossD]

I'm new so feel free to school me..

What is that small entrance hole for on the bottom side of these all brass padlocks? I also see these holes on other types of padlocks. The small hole is on the opposite side of the china engrave on this particular lock.

Do these holes serve a purpose in lock resetting, or pin adjusting, or is this primarily for draining/venting the lock? Any info or links is always appreciated. Thanks.

[Oldfast]

@ RossD
Nice to meet ya, always good to see a new face. As to the holes, you're correct- they're placed there for drainage so water does not build up inside the lock.

@TastyCat
After spending so much time with that lock, I'm sure your skill with spools will impove. For example, I rencently had an American series 50 whoop on me for the better part of 2 wks! But all that time spent with serrated pins really helped me become familiar with them. After that I was able to pick two 1100's, an 1105, and a 5200- all of them only took a couple of minutes each instead of a couple weeks. I guess I'm just saying hang in there and I think you'll be pleased with the results later.

[RossD]

I have a task force doing the same thing now. Picked it once but haven't gotten it again. Maybe I'm doing this wrong, but I'm lifting each pin with a half hook pick and using varying tension. These locks have very poor tolerances. The first pin that's visible in the key hole is clearly not at shear point, but doesn't seem to lock into place unless too much tension is applied to the barrel. I met a guy who was a former lock smith and he started raking like crazy on it for a good 15 minutes with no luck.

Hopefully I'm learning the correct method here with trying each pin. I'm using it as a learning tool to identifying pin shear points. Is it better to just rake away and hope for the best?

[chriswingate]

Hopefully I'm learning the correct method here with trying each pin. I'm using it as a learning tool to identifying pin shear points. Is it better to just rake away and hope for the best?

Now this all depends on what you are trying to learn, raking may help you open the lock quickly, say you are on a lock out, and you have jobs piling on, you can get to the next one quicker...but if you are trying to learn to pick for the sake of the hobby and satisfaction of defeating a lock, then SPP is the way to go. There are locks that you just will not be able to rake, especially when you get into higher security stuff, that is when SPP will really come into play.

It's all about practice, trying different levels of force on the tension wrench, from light to heavy. Try lifting each pin gently until you feel it set, other times you may have to give it a good hard nudge to get it above the sheer line. If you are messing with spools, then you will have to learn how to work with the counter-rotation they give you when they bind on th sheer. It will all come with practice and experience.

[Oldfast]

Yea, your definetly on the right track by focusing on each pin individually (SPP-single pin picking). This'll be your main form of attack with most locks and will help you learn the basic concept of picking. Raking/scrubbing are great techniques especially when used in conjunction with SPP. But, as you progress to "higher security" locks, you'll find that simply raking is not going to open the vast majority of them.

The first pin that's visible in the key hole is clearly not at shear point, but doesn't seem to lock into place unless too much tension is applied to the barrel.

Hopefully I'm learning the correct method here with trying each pin. I'm using it as a learning tool to identifying pin shear points. Is it better to just rake away and hope for the best?

Just be sure that your setting the pins in the correct order. If pin 1 is reacting in the way you've described, odds are it's not the one you should be setting at that time. There's a "binding order" that's unique and different for each lock. This may be from back-front (4321), front-back (1234), or a random order like 4231. Basically you want to find the pin that gives you the most resistance (binding) and set that one, then on to the next most binding pin. Constantly comparing the pins will help to determine this. Sometimes it's quite obvious, other times not so obvious. If your using too much tension, multiple pins will bind making it difficult to discipher the correct one. Too little tension obviously will not bind any pins.

Watch lots of youtube videos. If a pictures worth a thousand words, a video's worth a million!
A good read to start with (if ya haven't already) is the MIT Guide to lockpicking.
http://www.capricorn.org/~akira/home/lockpick/

[Oldfast]

LOL. Chris, as always your so quick on the draw. LOL

[chriswingate]

LOL. Chris, as always your so quick on the draw. LOL

Haha, thanks man!

[RossD]

You guys are on the ball! This is definitely an odd order lock. Pin 2 and 3 seem to be the worst, so I'm focusing on those to start. Also trying some different picks as I think my half hook is over setting the pin.

I'm DLing the MIT guide to my Nook. Will review immediately. Also going to be purchasing that commercially the available Locksmithing book. Lots to learn.

[Oldfast]

Sounds like a GREAT start to me

[Life Of Dreams]

Well thank you both - you're giving me some hope! I've got a Schlage deadbolt that's all spools except for one driver, and I LOVE it. What I wouldn't give for a good 10-degree false set on this thing! When that cylinder starts rotating backwards, I know EXACTLY what's going on, and there's very little that feeds back so much in picking so far in my experience. So now that I know that I'm probably dealing with spools, I might begin by raking to try and achieve a false set, then go from there, because, pretty much just like my Schlage, I can't seem to set anything at all, so chances are I haven't ever set the driver pin, and the spools are just laughing at me. We'll see who LAUGHS LAST, MAGGOTS!!!

Thanks fellas - sure appreciate it. I'll post back when I'm successful for my virtual victory lap.

I'm not very experienced, but I've just SPP'd a tough 7 pin by: first raking with very light tension to achieve the false set, then taking it form there. It would only false set with a 3 peak bogart (probably the wrong name) and would set with a 2 peak nor a city rake.

[theTastyCat]

Sorry to necro this thread, but I figured this would be the logical place for an update.

Took the padlock by the ONE actual brick and mortar locksmith shop I could find in NASHVILLE, TENNESSEE - I finally got smart and did an internet search of locksmiths, then put all their addresses into Street View. As I figured, all but ONE that I found were actually bakeries, car dealerships, and vacant lots. Why is such a large segment of the profession so sketchy?

Anyway, I digress. Took it in, asked if anybody could pick it, since I sure couldn't. Well, they couldn't find any picks at first, so I offered mine, and of course they told me it was against the law to have them (which it's not - I checked again tonight, and TCA 39-14-701, "Possession of burglary tools", reads: A person who possesses any tool, machine or implement with intent to use the same, or allow the same to be used, to commit any burglary, commits a Class A misdemeanor. There's a new Locksmith Licensing Act in TN as well, but I e-mailed several state congressmen and they all agreed that if I wasn't charging others to do locksmithing services, I should be OK. This protects groups like off-duty cops who volunteer to do car lockouts, etc.). I digress AGAIN. The one guy said it had mushroom pins and was likely an American rebrand, which has been mentioned here, but not the mushrooms. He spent 20 minutes and got nowhere. He said another smith had only picked open two American padlocks in 30 years, but he also said Medeco weren't pickable, so I kind of knew what to expect from there on out. So I was hoping he could pick it and could give me some hints, but no dice. This lock goes in the "too hard for me right now" pile along with my SFIC cores. I did ask if he could sell me old junk locks, but got nowhere.

He did show me some really neat Medeco locks though, such as one that beeps and lights up and records who entered when. And he had a Mul-T-Lock demo, which was amazing - is that thing possibly pickable?

[Haddo]

I thought it was just me being inexperienced.
I have been trying to pick this same lock for a week. Like you even the bogatas didn't work.
I have pick just about every lock I can find around the house except this one.
I guess I'll try some of the tricks mentioned in this thread.