What can we discuss here and whats it all about

[dls]

If we cant discuss destructive entry methods in this open forum can we discuss ways to prevent it here without breaking site rules?

If we cant discuss these methods of destructive attack can we say the lock is open source as all the info as to its design is not available?

Should the open source lock be moved to the advanced area to be developed and then released to the public as a finished product with all its design features warts and all freely available in the end anyway?

What are we trying to develop here anyway will it ever become a reality or is it going to remain a never ending topic with no end result?

If it is to become a reality should the manufacturers come on board at the development stage for funding of prototypes etc.?

[shortlineflyer]

I agree with you. It can be very difficult to talk about an open source lock when so many topics are not allowed to be discussed. I admit I do not knot much at all about destructive entry but it does not seem like it should be an advanced topic, or at least not all aspect of destructive entry should be classified as advanced. with certain types of destructive entry it makes sense to make them advanced, such as safe drilling, but i dont think other types like drilling a keyway should be classified as advanced.

[Legion303]

I don't really see any problem discussing defense against DE. I mean, people know you can drill locks (we don't need to go into specifics), and it's not revealing anything to say "this type of open source lock should have a rotating outer face to prevent drill attacks" or whatnot. There are ways to discuss it without explicitly giving anything away.

That said, if there are really restricted things to talk about, maybe we should have a separate OSL section under Advanced for just such discussions.

-steve

[shortlineflyer]

i agree , I too think there should be a second osl

[FarmerFreak]

I don't know. I don't really see the point of having a second OSL forum specifically to cover destructive entry. Maybe I'm just biased because I work as a locksmith.

Even though there are many different tools used for destructive entry. For some reason I imagine all the threads will end with thermite destroying the lock...

[chriswingate]

For some reason I imagine all the threads will end with thermite destroying the lock...

Now where on earth would you get an idea like that FarmerFreak? haha

[Squelchtone]

If we cant discuss these methods of destructive attack can we say the lock is open source as all the info as to its design is not available?

It's one thing to say this lock will have a steel insert in front of the first pin stack in order to prevent a drilling attack, versus saying "someone could walk up and use a 1/8 inch drill bit and put it 1/4 inch above the keyway and drill at 200 rpm for 15 seconds and defeat the lock, so I propose that we install a steel insert in front of the first pin stack in order to stop such an attack"

Do you see the difference in what would be considered a design element versus blatant instructions on how to preform a DE attack which would then be breaking site rules?

Squelchtone

[dls]

ok here is the reasoning for my post
I have some ideas for various ways to protect locks from destructive entry which is by far the most common method of entry where scumbags are concerned but in order to discuss them properly in the true spirit of open source i have to discuss these methods and flaws which allow them to work openly.

Can an open source lock ever be a reality if it cant be discussed openly in an open forum

[mh]

Hi dls,

Once a concrete version of The Open Source Lock will be defined, i.e. close to prototyping - as opposed to vague ideas - then of course we will need a place to discuss protection against destructive entry.

My idea of "open" in this context includes the disclosure of how long it will offer protection to which methods of destructive entry.

But I'm not sure if the open section of lp101 is the right place for this, because of the wide audience that can later read this from another perspective e.g. via google, incl: how can I break any lock with little effort.
We will find a good place once we are close to that stage.

Cheers
mh