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Question about pins setting

Having read the FAQ's you are still unfulfilled and seek more enlightenment, so post your general lock picking questions here.
Forum rules
Do not post safe related questions in this sub forum! Post them in This Old Safe

The sub forum you are currently in is for asking Beginner Hobby Lock Picking questions only.

Question about pins setting

Postby BbGenesis » 13 Jul 2011 23:48

Hello all,
First let me apologize for the stupid question but it's really been bugging me the past hour.

First of all I've been trying to get back into picking on a masterlock no.140 and a mountain security walmart piece of junk keyed doorknob.

Anyway everything I read says light tension but I've never been sure on that as to how light it light enough. I used to use a little over the weight of my finger but now I've been trying to do it by just gently resting my finger against the tension wrench so that theres barely any torque. I can move the pins better like this for sure and I like it but I'm still having a lot of trouble finding the binding pin, by guessing what is meant by binding I would guess that it's the pin that feels slightly more sticky and not as free moving up and down as the others but with that amount of tension it's hard for me to make a distinction. The reason I lightened up is I thought I was using too much tension because sometimes I couldn't get the pins to move so I would have to lighten up which would cause other pins to drop back down sometimes. Is my thinking right on the binding pin? That it doesn't really bind up to the point of not moving but instead just feels a little more sticky than the other pins?

My other question is in every guide I read it says you can hear the pins click into place, I can't hear this happen, even with my ear to the lock. The only time I hear it click is when I accidentally put more tension on it and the pin snaps up too high. Any hints there? Is there really a click and I'm just missing it? I can also hear pins dropping down sometimes but never a distinct click into place.

Thanks for any ideas everyone, I had the masterlock down pretty well before I started doubting my tension technique but I also feel like there was also a little luck in there too (I did have it to an average of 30 seconds though). The mountain security lock I had to take two pins out of for me to be able to pick it, I plan on trying 4 in it tomorrow but I know these locks are harder to pick just because of how crappy they are built but yeah with only 3 pins in it I can pop it in about 2 seconds because it has a basic up down up down pinning. Anyway thanks again for any ideas anyone has, I appreciate it.
BbGenesis
 
Posts: 29
Joined: 27 Jun 2011 13:45

Re: Question about pins setting

Postby deception » 14 Jul 2011 1:07

BbGenesis wrote:Anyway everything I read says light tension but I've never been sure on that as to how light it light enough. I used to use a little over the weight of my finger but now I've been trying to do it by just gently resting my finger against the tension wrench so that theres barely any torque. I can move the pins better like this for sure and I like it but I'm still having a lot of trouble finding the binding pin, by guessing what is meant by binding I would guess that it's the pin that feels slightly more sticky and not as free moving up and down as the others but with that amount of tension it's hard for me to make a distinction. The reason I lightened up is I thought I was using too much tension because sometimes I couldn't get the pins to move so I would have to lighten up which would cause other pins to drop back down sometimes. Is my thinking right on the binding pin? That it doesn't really bind up to the point of not moving but instead just feels a little more sticky than the other pins?


You could try alternating tension on it, and see if that helps. light medium light medium.. Just to find the binding pin, as well as picking the security pins in it. You do know the Master no. 140 has security pins in it right? I'm not positive on how many, but if your a novice picker, and only picking 2 pins with the KIK, you might want to put the 140 down, and practice picking for awhile.

My other question is in every guide I read it says you can hear the pins click into place, I can't hear this happen, even with my ear to the lock. The only time I hear it click is when I accidentally put more tension on it and the pin snaps up too high. Any hints there? Is there really a click and I'm just missing it? I can also hear pins dropping down sometimes but never a distinct click into place.


As for this, try not to listen for the pins setting, more so try and feel the pins set. I'm guessing your a hobby picker, as a Locksmith though, it's not always dead quiet when your picking a lock, and you really have to feel what the lock is telling you.
deception
 
Posts: 90
Joined: 10 Jun 2011 14:43

Re: Question about pins setting

Postby BbGenesis » 14 Jul 2011 8:46

Ok thanks I appreciate it. Yeah I knew the 140 has security pins though I'm on the fence about how many, everything I read said the new 140's could have 1 to all 4 security pins and that it's randomly done as opposed to the old ones which only had a security pin in the third position. The 140 is actually way easier to pick than the crappy lock, heck the mountain security lock barely opens with the key. But no the 140 is a piece of cake for me, it just started taking longer to pick when I started worrying that I was using too much tension and creating bad habits. I just wanted to make sure, thanks for the reply.
BbGenesis
 
Posts: 29
Joined: 27 Jun 2011 13:45

Re: Question about pins setting

Postby GhostNode » 14 Jul 2011 12:41

One thing I'll do with a padlock (assuming it's not locked to anything fixed like a door or bracket) is shake it. If the top pin is set, the bottom pin should move freely without spring-force, and will thus "jiggle" when shaking the lock. HOWEVER if it does jiggle, there is still a possibility your top pin hasn't completely set, and is stuck in the sheer line (i believe this is called "sheered"?), so keep that in mind too.
GhostNode
 
Posts: 6
Joined: 11 Jul 2011 12:55

Re: Question about pins setting

Postby MrScruff » 20 Jul 2011 11:49

With regards to how light is light enough I pose the following question, have you ever had a butterfly land on your arm? Pretend your finger is a butterfly on the tension tool.
"We all sit around in a circle and suppose, while the secret sits in the center and knows." --Robert Frost
MrScruff
 
Posts: 165
Joined: 15 Jul 2011 12:50
Location: Manitoba, Canada


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