why isn't lock turning completely when picked???

[mynameismud]

I'm fairly new to picking. I read a book, I've watched videos, I've played around with various types of locks. I've been using a short hook exclusively, to try to get a good feel for it. Anyway, the issue is with a lock that I have in my house. It's a Callan dead bolt. I know it's not recommended to pick your own locks, but I wanted to try once when I was flying through other locks. I was able to pick the Callan dead bolt easily, and cleanly, BUT when it turned, it should turn a quarter turn, but it only turned an eighth of a turn. Why??? I actually put a slight bend in my tension rod trying to turn it more. I haven't taken a Callan dead bolt apart so I'm not sure what it looks like inside, but I've been practicing on a different brand dead bolt that swings easily around (but is not installed in a door). Is there a trick to getting it turned the full quarter turn? Again, I'm fairly new to picking, so I'm still learning, but am confused by this.

[Buzo]

Just curious, are you turning it in the right direction? Considering I don't have any experience with that particular brand I can't say why it wouldn't turn all the way if you were. Give it a day or so and the pros on here will probably know exactly why.

[Buzo]

Is it an interchangable core? If so, you may have picked the control shear line instead of the operating shear line. If you picked the control shear the core would pull straight out of the door...

[mynameismud]

Ha. Yes, I am turning in the right direction, I double checked that. The other thing is that I've never picked a fully assembled dead bolt, so I didn't know if this was normal or if this is because of the particular lock.

[mynameismud]

Buzo, you've got me there. Like I said, I'm fairly new to this, and as far as shear lines go, I apparently missed the fact that there are multiple shear lines, unless you're talking about completing pushing the bottom pins up into where the top pins are. If that's the case, no, I'm fairly confident that didn't happen. Also, I don't know what you mean by interchangeable core. I'll have to go read about that.

[cledry]

I'm fairly new to picking. I read a book, I've watched videos, I've played around with various types of locks. I've been using a short hook exclusively, to try to get a good feel for it. Anyway, the issue is with a lock that I have in my house. It's a Callan dead bolt. I know it's not recommended to pick your own locks, but I wanted to try once when I was flying through other locks. I was able to pick the Callan dead bolt easily, and cleanly, BUT when it turned, it should turn a quarter turn, but it only turned an eighth of a turn. Why??? I actually put a slight bend in my tension rod trying to turn it more. I haven't taken a Callan dead bolt apart so I'm not sure what it looks like inside, but I've been practicing on a different brand dead bolt that swings easily around (but is not installed in a door). Is there a trick to getting it turned the full quarter turn? Again, I'm fairly new to picking, so I'm still learning, but am confused by this.

It is just an ordinary generic deadbolt. You are saying when you turn with the key it turns 90 degrees, but when you pick it the lock only turns 45 degrees?

I cannot think of any possible reason for this.

In the past there have been locks that the tip of the key is required to be inserted fully before it will operate, but not on this lock AFAIK.

[Buzo]

There are not usually more than one shear line unless the lock has been master keyed or is an IC (interchangeable) core. That's a good one to look up on the forums here. Again, I have no idea why it wouldn't turn all the way...

[minifhncc]

Spool pins?

[Buzo]

It depends on how much the plug actually turned. Spools wouldn't let the plug 45 degrees.

@mynameismud - how far does the plug actually turn? If it feels like it is picked and the plug turns only slightly, you may have run into security pins. It will be one or more stacks "false setting" or giving the feel of being open when you've really only picked the regular pins. There are tons of threads about security pins so I would suggest reading those if this is the case. To do a quick check, once you feel the plug turn about 10 to 15 degrees, push up on each pin stack with your hook with light/medium tension on your wrench and see if you get any back pressure. What I mean by back pressure is counter-rotation on your tension wrench. If you put too much tension on it you won't get the feedback you need to feel for that push back.

[mynameismud]

Okay, I read up on interchangeable cores, and this lock definitely does not contain that type of core.

Yes, I was saying if the key is used to unlock it, turning the key 90 degrees will open the lock, but when picking the lock it only turned 45 degrees. I was going to check for security pins, but decided to first listen and look closer while turning the key. When turning the key, at 45 degrees there is quite a bit of resistance because that's where the deadbolt's latch is actually moved (it moves from 45 degrees until you reach 90 degrees). So, I picked the dead bolt again a few minutes ago, and then pulled out my tension tool, and used just the very tip of the key to rotate it the remaining 45 degrees, and it unlocked. So it turns out I was not having issues with the pins, but with the force of turning the lock.

Now that I know what the problem is, my new question is, with so much force needed to turn this lock, to get the latch moving, do I need a separate tool or just a sturdier tension rod? I think I mentioned before that I put a slight bend in my tension rod trying to rotate the lock. Is this normal to need this much force to get the latch to pull in on a dead bolt?

By the way, I appreciate all the responses. I enjoy learning about this stuff and I picked up a few things from reading the comments.

[mcsteve]

It's fairly common to pick a lock with the usual picks and tension tool, and then finish turning it with a flat screwdriver or similar implement. Especially with stiff deadbolts and padlocks.

[Buzo]

I'm glad it was something simple! Every lock you pick teaches you a lesson. Good job figuring it out and happy picking!

[Squelchtone]

Anyway, the issue is with a lock that I have in my house. It's a Callan dead bolt.

Glad you finally got it turned more than 45 degrees. Have you tried picking it while the door is wide open? If my theory is correct, the lock should turn past 45 degrees without a problem. I believe your deadbolt is dragging because your hinges are sagging, the frame isn't square or the bolt and strike box are misaligned. When you normally use a key, do you (perhaps subconsciously) push or pull the door with another hand in order for the key to work smoothly while unlocking or locking the door? By picking the door with it open, you eliminate the friction of the deabdolt going into the door frame, try this out and let us know.


[obligatory message about not picking one's own locks here]

Squelchtone

[cledry]

It's fairly common to pick a lock with the usual picks and tension tool, and then finish turning it with a flat screwdriver or similar implement. Especially with stiff deadbolts and padlocks.

I've been doing that for thirty years yet I never thought to mention that as a solution. It is such a common problem I guess I just do it almost subconsciously in the course of a day.

[mynameismud]

Glad you finally got it turned more than 45 degrees. Have you tried picking it while the door is wide open? If my theory is correct, the lock should turn past 45 degrees without a problem. I believe your deadbolt is dragging because your hinges are sagging, the frame isn't square or the bolt and strike box are misaligned. When you normally use a key, do you (perhaps subconsciously) push or pull the door with another hand in order for the key to work smoothly while unlocking or locking the door? By picking the door with it open, you eliminate the friction of the deabdolt going into the door frame, try this out and let us know.


[obligatory message about not picking one's own locks here]

Squelchtone

When I read your post, I immediately thought that was the issue, so I did pick it with the door open, and no difference, still a LOT of force (comparable to other locks) to turn the latch. Still had to use a screwdriver to turn it.

By the way, yes I was picking my own door's locks (an interior garage door), but I'm replacing the dead bolts and handles on all of my entry doors due to the knobs being pieces of junk. Those locks I will not pick.

I've learned quite a bit from this experience, and very much appreciate everyones help. I guess my next effort will be working on spool pin locks. Thanks again everybody.