Security pins for Best/Arrow/Etc.. SFIC Cores?

[SeattleTexan]

So I was considering going with something expensive like Abloy Protec Cliq or MT5+ Cliq, but ended up caving for less expensive, and going with a lot of Best cores I bought off eBay, altho I only have three padlocks switched to the new system, thus far.
I did my research on the Best system before I bought these, and I know they're a bit harder than most locks to pick, because they have a tighter tolerance, but they are susceptible to being bumped. Eh... Se la vie.
The question is, if each core is operated by 3 different keys (lock key, section key, master key), plus the control key, can I buy or make some type of security pins that won't {vulgar term for intercourse} up my core so bad I can't even use the control key, but will eliminate or reduce the ablity to bump the lock? I know people have made spools and serrated pins for non master keyed locks, and have been able to reduce or eliminate the ability for that lock to be bumped. I've just never heard of it for an SFIC lock.

I'd have been a little bit happier if the Kaba Peaks cores I was given would fit a Best SFIC lock, and not a Corbin/Russwin LFIC lock. But I digress...

Also, how hard is it to repin these?
My aim is to have one set of cores in my locks, another set of cores on standby (different keyway), and the ability to swap cores, repin the pulled cores, and originate new keys for the pulled cores, without visiting the locksmith, in the event my keys are lost or stolen....

Or I need to lock out my next ex-girlfriend.

[Evan]

I did my research on the Best system before I bought these, and I know they're a bit harder than most locks to pick, because they have a tighter tolerance, but they are susceptible to being bumped.

@SeattleTexan:

It does sound like you learned a bit about SFIC's before you bought your locks... Sadly there is no security pin you can add to the cylinder's existing chambers which will stop or prevent bumping them...

The question is, if each core is operated by 3 different keys (lock key, section key, master key), plus the control key, can I buy or make some type of security pins that won't "mess" up my core so bad I can't even use the control key, but will eliminate or reduce the ablity to bump the lock? I know people have made spools and serrated pins for non master keyed locks, and have been able to reduce or eliminate the ability for that lock to be bumped. I've just never heard of it for an SFIC lock.

There are security pins made for SFIC's for each and every pin size which are made by Best Access Systems, I have seen such a kit, also made are hardened stainless steel pins which are used in the first two chambers from the face of the lock to add some drill resistance...

While you think that SFIC's are operated by many keys (your example was a Level III Grandmaster key system of a change key, master key and top master key, in "Best lingo": an operating key, a master key and the system grandmaster) surprisingly most all SFIC's only have 3 or 4 pin segments in each stack unless they are special cross-keyed cores or are mastered at the control shear line... You can have commonly have a Level IV or Level V master key system using SFIC's and still only have 4 pin segments in each chamber of the core...

If you were to have cores made up for your house they would no doubt only have 3 pin segments per chamber as they would only have an operating key and a control key...

Also, how hard is it to repin these?
My aim is to have one set of cores in my locks, another set of cores on standby (different keyway), and the ability to swap cores, repin the pulled cores, and originate new keys for the pulled cores, without visiting the locksmith, in the event my keys are lost or stolen....

It is not difficult to re-pin SFIC's once you learn the math to the pinning system... The pinning kits are expensive though as you need 10 bottom pin sizes and 19 upper pin sizes... Plus some pin tweezers, a capping block, a capping pin, an ejector pin... It is a bit of an investment to equip yourself to re-pin SFIC's...

Most people who use SFIC's for the instant re-key ability would have a set of new cores ready to go, and would have the old cores re-keyed by a locksmith and set back aside as the standby set...

~~ Evan

[SeattleTexan]

I thought it better to know what I'm getting into, before making the conversion. After running a search the other night, I found out that Medeco makes the KeyMark X4, which will retrofit into Best style IC locks. They offer the Nexgen XT, but I despise that gargantuan "key" for it. No way in hell that would fit on a normal key ring, and still leave room for my car key. It's all some joint venture between Medeco and Arrow. So question time:
Has anyone fooled with the KeyMark X4 to check for the ability to bump it and pick it? If they're good (obviously, I'm not looking for impenetrable, just not east to get thru quietly.) If they're good, I'll switch to them when I get my key system figured out on the Best locks.
Then more of a hardware question, but does anyone make a Best compatible IC lockset (lever or knob), that doesn't require extra thru-bolting? The deadbolts I've seen don't seem to require the extra thru-bolts. I'm gonna be replacing doors anyway, but I don't wanna screw up my new doors with extra bolt/screw holes, when I'm not going to leave the locks here when I rent this place out after it's updated. (Okay, kinda considering leaving them in, so if I have to do a 72 hour eviction notice, I have a good way to lock the guilty parties out at the end of the 72nd hour.)
Another thing I like about the IC system, if I have to have someone come in and work on the house, and I can't be there, I just swap out the cores I want to give them access to, put a temp code in the alarm system, and when the job is over, I don't have to give a rip if the jerk duped my key, just put my usual cores back in.
When I really think about it, yes, having IC's is more hassle than the Cliq system I wanted to run with originally, because I have take the time to switch the physical cores out, versus walk around with a programming key to authorize or de-authorize specific keys, and yes, I can't set time and calendar lock outs. But the IC system really isn't that bad of an idea for a residential application, at least how I see it. If you don't care about keys getting copied, just get a 7-pin system. If you want something a little higher security, get the KeyMark cores. Yes, I'd still like to have my electromechanical locks tied into my Insteon system, but for right now, this is more cost effective of a method. Tho I will say it's too bad that Assa Abloy hasn't put their Abloy and Mul-T-Lock keyways into Best compatible cores, considering that Best has a more prolific client base than Schlage or Yale IC products, at least as far as I can tell.
That ramble aside...
The knobs/levers I'm looking for are what Best calls "Corridor Function". Basically, you switch it between unlocked and self-locking using a key on the INSIDE lever/knob. I like this idea, because the Protec lock I have is what's called "store room function." Push the button on the inside knob in to lock it once, push and turn to make it self locking. Problem is, I FREQUENTLY hit that stupid button and lock myself out. Thankfully, I have a set of keys in an obscure and secure location for just that instance. Plus, giving someone a key to get in, doesn't mean they can rig a door to stay unlocked. Anyone know where I can buy SFIC locks that will show me a price up front, other than the usual auction site? Preferably reasonably priced?

[SeattleTexan]

@Evan,
Sorry, I got off on a tangent and forgot to respond to your comments.
I've seen Best pin kits on eBay for around $185. Would you suspect those are basic pin kits, or security pins?
I'm a tinkerer, so honestly, I'd like to do the repin myself. I figure the more I can do on my own, the better off I'd be. Plus, locks and keys have been a long time interest of mine. The more complex the better. It's an Asperger's thing. Same with my garage door openers. But I digress.
Other than the pin kit, the punches (I'm assuming that's something I'd need to get from a lockists's supply), capping block, capping pin, ejector pin, and tweezers, what else would I need? Can I reuse the caps, or would I need to replace them every time? Are the security pins hardened stainless as well, or the standard brass? Could I repin the KeyMark X4 (Medeco) that I mentioned in my last post? I realise the sidebar and rotating pins make it a bit more complicated than a repin of my Best locks, but I figure nothing worth having (knowledge or otherwise) comes easily.
(And my mind diverts to a lame "that's what she said" remark.)
When you mentioned the Level IV system... In theory, I could have the system set up something like House Master > Door Master > Door Exterior > Core Key + Control? Would going from a Level III to a Level IV make the cores less secure? (That's possibly a dumb thing for me to ask, considering I know that means another combination can open the lock.)
One more thing, where can I get key blanks with a larger bow? The Best keys are good, but they're kinda hard to handle, especially on a couple of the locks I have. I found some on Lockit.com/shop, and they say they match my keyway (I cross referenced the Ilco key they listed to my own, and while they say their key will only support 6 pins, tho the Ilco key is listed to work for 7-pin), but I can't get a response if their keys will actually work with a 7-pin system. I've not found that Best offers anything larger than the usual key, unless I get on the Coremax system, altho I can't verify that the Coremax keys are any bigger, just more restrictive. (Heh, I can find the WA, WB, and WC key blanks on eBay.)

[Evan]

I've seen Best pin kits on eBay for around $185. Would you suspect those are basic pin kits, or security pins?

@SeattleTexan:

That definitely sounds like just a standard Best A2 pinning kit for that price...

Other than the pin kit, the punches (I'm assuming that's something I'd need to get from a lockists's supply), capping block, capping pin, ejector pin, and tweezers, what else would I need?

The pin kits get pricey, especially with the "security" and "hardened stainless" pins which you would have to obtain from a distributor who stocks OEM Best products since I have not seen an aftermarket or third-party source for the real SFIC security pins in each size...

Also expensive is the bitting punch, whether you obtain an actual OEM Best one or a Pro Lok blue punch they retail for a bit higher than $1,000 each depending on who you purchase it from...

Can I reuse the caps, or would I need to replace them every time?

It is not a good idea to re-use the chamber caps when you recombinate a core, they deform quite a bit when you tap them in and are again when ejecting the stack with the ejector pin... Trying to reuse the caps could cause you problems if a cap comes out while the core is installed i a lock...

Are the security pins hardened stainless as well, or the standard brass?

Best makes three kinds of pins: hardened stainless, standard brass, and spooled brass...

When you mentioned the Level IV system... In theory, I could have the system set up something like House Master > Door Master > Door Exterior > Core Key + Control?

It sounds like you did not understand that Level III/Level IV keying systems generally have hundreds or thousands of keys in them when they are applied and used properly... For your application all you need is a simple master key system with an MK and you would cross key two change keys into being your "Door Master" and "Door Exterior" keys...

Ex: MK = AA
1AA = Door Master
2AA = Door Exterior
3AA = Bedroom (or whatever)
4AA = Garage
5AA = etc, etc.

So the keying of the inside of the door would be:
X1AA: operated by: AA. 1AA

And the keying of the outside of the door would be:
X2AA: operated by: AA, 1AA, 2AA

Would going from a Level III to a Level IV make the cores less secure? (That's possibly a dumb thing for me to ask, considering I know that means another combination can open the lock.)

Yes, master keying a lock makes it less secure than an identical non-master keyed lock as far as picking goes, but master keyed or not unless the cylinder in question is an expensive UL-437 rated one they have identical vulnerabilities to other problems...

One more thing, where can I get key blanks with a larger bow? The Best keys are good, but they're kinda hard to handle, especially on a couple of the locks I have. I found some on Lockit.com/shop, and they say they match my keyway (I cross referenced the Ilco key they listed to my own, and while they say their key will only support 6 pins, tho the Ilco key is listed to work for 7-pin), but I can't get a response if their keys will actually work with a 7-pin system. I've not found that Best offers anything larger than the usual key, unless I get on the Coremax system, altho I can't verify that the Coremax keys are any bigger, just more restrictive. (Heh, I can find the WA, WB, and WC key blanks on eBay.)

For larger bow keys or neuter bow keys I recommend Kustom Key, Inc.

< External link to Kustom Key, Inc. webpage >

~~ Evan

[Evan]

Are the security pins hardened stainless as well, or the standard brass?

Best makes three kinds of pins: hardened stainless, standard brass, and spooled brass...

So it is a bit more complicated than my simple description above:

Standard beveled (bottom) pins are available in: nickel silver and hardened stainless steel from Best and in Brass from 3rd party manufacturers (which usually come color coded)...

Standard flat (top) pins are available in: brass and hardened stainless...

Spooled beveled (bottom) pins are available in: nickel silver...

Spooled flat (top) pins are available in: brass...

~~ Evan

[SeattleTexan]

Wow, Thanks for all the info.
I think I'm going to leave the rekeying of cores to a locksmith. I found most of the equipment, (down time and a smart phone) and It's a hefty investment. Maybe one day I'll equip myself so thoroughly, but for now, I think I'll just buy a decent manual duplicator and a couple boxes of key blanks, and be satisfied with being able to cut my own house keys on blanks of my choosing. I'll stick to rekeying the old Kwikset and Schlage locks that are collecting dust in my garage.

So do you think the Medeco KeyMark x4 would be a worthwhile upgrade at a slightly later point?

Is there an SFIC knob/lever without extra thru-bolting, in a "corridor" function" as Best Calls it?

[Raymond]

There are many brands of locksets that have the through bolts as an option. They can either be installed or left off as determined at the time of installation. Use a grade 2 (commercial) or grade 1 (commercial heavy duty) with a clutched lever. Knobs generally have a smaller footprint and usually last longer.

Most SFIC blanks are a standard length that can be cut for either 6 or 7 pin. We specifically order the cores per length but only order one blank. Be careful about getting a large head on the key as it is real easy to put too much force on it. If you use nickle-silver blanks you will be impressed with their strength. You can easily weld or rivet on an extra handle if needed.

Regarding bumping... Keymark blanks are generally unavailable as they are patented, different, and issued to specific locksmiths. It would be a lot of trouble to make a good set of bump keys if you cannot get blanks.

Also, an SFIC core stops the keyblank at the bottom of the blank and at the rear of the plug by a steel snap ring or a riveted back plate. Trying to bump a core tends to knock the back key stop out or breaks it off completely. This ruins the core and makes the correct key spacing not line up. Plus, bumping an SFIC is definitely not consistently sucessful

[Evan]

Is there an SFIC knob/lever without extra thru-bolting, in a "corridor" function" as Best Calls it?

@SeattleTexan:

The problem you seem to be running into is that the particular lock function you are interested in is typically only available with Grade 1 hardware and such hardware has through bolting in order to enhance its durability and protect against some types of attacks...

This type of lock function is also called "Public Entrance" or "Public Restroom" ANSI F09 for exactly the reason why you want it, the keys the users of the space possess are not keyed into the inner cylinder to allow them to leave the door unlocked, only those who possess master keys or a key for the inner cylinder can set the lock to remain unlocked...

~~ Evan

[cledry]

It sounds like you did not understand that Level III/Level IV keying systems generally have hundreds or thousands of keys in them when they are applied and used properly... For your application all you need is a simple master key system with an MK and you would cross key two change keys into being your "Door Master" and "Door Exterior" keys...

Ex: MK = AA
1AA = Door Master
2AA = Door Exterior
3AA = Bedroom (or whatever)
4AA = Garage
5AA = etc, etc.

So the keying of the inside of the door would be:
X1AA: operated by: AA. 1AA

And the keying of the outside of the door would be:
X2AA: operated by: AA, 1AA, 2AA

~~ Evan

Evan in your example I notice you use X1AA as the nomenclature. Does BEST use different nomenclature than most lock systems? Where X denotes cross keying? For example in a 2 level system 1AA would already be operated by master key AA, so it wouldn't be X1AA just 1AA. Your second example X2AA follows normal nomenclature where it is cross-keyed to two different change keys.

[Evan]

Evan in your example I notice you use X1AA as the nomenclature. Does BEST use different nomenclature than most lock systems? Where X denotes cross keying? For example in a 2 level system 1AA would already be operated by master key AA, so it wouldn't be X1AA just 1AA. Your second example X2AA follows normal nomenclature where it is cross-keyed to two different change keys.

@cledry:

I have never seen a factory produced system from Best use the SKCS... They have their own entire method of showing the hierarchy of the keying system which was discussed here: Stamping Keys

Sadly since most Best systems are supervised by people with no actual training in locks they end up using and stamping blind numerical codes which do not show the relationship or hierarchy of the keys in the system without a method of interpreting it like a chart...

Agreed the example above was exaggerated but it was done so to call attention to the situation and show it as a special keying situation, as the OP could be interested in having a front door key and a rear door key which are separate from AA-1...

~~ Evan

[SeattleTexan]

Wow, It's been forever since I've been here.

So the switch is finally complete. 3 Arrow RK knobs on store room function, 2 Dorma double cylinder deadbolts, 2 Arrow rim cylinders, and 3 Master padlocks. My current key system goes like this:
1>Grand Master
2>Door Master
3>Cylinder Key
(Control on GM level)

I like this. Because I have double cylinder dead bolts, I can leave a key nearby for egress, but if it gets lifted, it can't get into the house, only out. Less of a worry.
I also like the fact that I only have to fool with one key now for everything.
I recently switched from cable to fibre optic, and left the tech a key to the front door. Obviously, this wasn't the keyway I was using. I have a couple of 6-pin A's that I swapped into the front door, and when I got home to find the work was done, I swapped back over to my usual 7-pin cores. No worrying about if there's a spare key floating around that I'm unaware of.
While I like the self locking function of these, I do still want to find the corridor function locksets. I still have to rebuild the deck gate, which will get an SFIC knob set to match the rest, with what Arrow calls "Communicating" function. Basically, I use a key in either knob to only unlock that knob, that way they can both be locked, and will require a key to enter or exit. I'm currently using one of my padlocks to secure the deck gate. I'll have ped gates on the fence, once I get that project complete, and they'll also be Communicating function.
There's a possibility that once I finish the fence, and get the gate opener installed, there *might* be a keyswitch on it, which will also tie into the current key system.

I did hit one hiccup. One of my RK's outside knob started falling off 2 weeks after I installed it. A problem with the knob retaining pin. If I turned the knob anti-clockwise while locked, there was an audible and tactile click, followed shortly by the knob falling off in my hand. I called the lockist I bought them from, and they shipped me a new one relatively quickly, and the issue is resolved.

[SeattleTexan]

I goofed. My RK's are not "Storeroom Function", by Arrow standards. They are "Entrance/Office Function".

[SeattleTexan]

So I'm now a bit better equipped. I have a Pak-A-Punch cutter, with adaptors and key decoder for A2, A3, and A4, one box of new/old stock Best blanks ("It is illegal to duplicate this key" or something similar), a LAB Annex pinning block and punches, and a LAB pinning kit is on its way. (Snag with USPS. Go figure.) So now I've arrived at another questionable situation. What's the best formula for my 7-pin Level III system, to be able to repin easily and securely? I've noticed on my existing system, all aside my control key have 1, 2, and 3 pinned the same, effectively leaving only 4-7 to differ between all operating keys across all 3 levels. When repinning, can I utilize more than 2 differs in 1-3, or must they be pinned this way for IC function?
Thanks in advance!