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European Key Question

European hardware -lever locks, profile cylinders specific for European locks. European lock picks and European locks.

European Key Question

Postby EuropeanAmerican » 12 Nov 2012 12:43

Hi All,
So I am staying in Slovakia for the time being. I have wondered what these old style European keys are exactly. Here is a link to a similar one below.

http://humanrightsembassy.org/images/social/old-key.jpg

I have noticed that there are often times numbers etched in the handle portion of the key. Do they have any significance? Why are these keys used sometimes for interior doors?

Thanks!
EuropeanAmerican
 
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Re: European Key Question

Postby zeepia » 12 Nov 2012 12:49

Old indeed. Warded locks and numbers don´t mean anything. I mean, no secret code to decode the lock.

These locks can be very old and stll functioning. My sommer place has an old shed from year 1793 and it has an original working lock on it. And a very BIG key, like 25cm 8)
zeepia
 
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Re: European Key Question

Postby ARF-GEF » 19 Nov 2012 10:49

wow 1793... that was quite some time ago! It's plain historic! It was so long ago that Finnland had a swedis king back then(?)
King Gustav the 3rd or was it already Gustav Adolf?
Do you people have many such old antique locks lying around or is it just yours?
Maybe I should pay more attention to locks on sheds next time I visit one of the nice Scandinavian countries.
If sometime in the future you have the time and opportunity, would you mind posting a pic. about the lock and the key? I would surely find it fascinating.
Is is still working all right?
To infinity... and beyond!
ARF-GEF
 
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Re: European Key Question

Postby ARF-GEF » 19 Nov 2012 10:55

Looked it up in the wikipedia. In the slight chance that anyone (else) was wondering: it was Gustav Adolph (the 4th).
(Sorry for this minor hijack of the thread. This was all.)
But the lock still enthralls me:)
To infinity... and beyond!
ARF-GEF
 
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Re: European Key Question

Postby ARF-GEF » 19 Nov 2012 11:17

So to help you with your original question EuropeanAmerican
Warded lock used to be widespread in Europe because they are rather cheap and simple to produce (at least with today's technology) compared to most modern locks.
(And that's why they are used indoors where there's no need for special security measures.) They are known to be very reliable too. (Though the working one from 1793 still surprised me a bit.)
They were used overall in Europe in the middle ages (I'm not sure what the indigenous people of the Americas used back then(?)). They did not really offer much security though. More often than not they can be picked with the simplest skeleton keys.
If you are interested in locks you can find beautiful, elaborate keys from the 17th century onwards. Real works of art. Man, some of them required real skilled locksmiths to be made without any of the modern machinery.

One type of them is explained by some marvellous pictures in Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warded_lock
A different kind is explained in this very forum by captn.dunc (it's a superb post worth reading if you are unfamiliar with them) : viewtopic.php?t=7620
To infinity... and beyond!
ARF-GEF
 
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Re: European Key Question

Postby zeepia » 19 Nov 2012 13:04

Little more off topic:

Image

I just cropped myself out of that photo...

That shed is from 1793 because there is a carving to show that and the lock seems to be original but I can not be sure.
Have never really looked it more closely, you know, it´s there and it works, so what´s the big deal? :)
It´s used almost daily when we are there. It couldn´t be picked easily because it requires a LOT of torque to turn.

I´ll take some pictures of it when I go there next time but it won´t be in near future.
It´s 360 km away, it´s a summer cottage and now it´s getting winter... And I have no business in anywhere near that place.
You find old sheds all over Finland, this old working locks are not so usual. I think.

I´ll be back some time next year!
zeepia
 
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Re: European Key Question

Postby ARF-GEF » 19 Nov 2012 17:29

Thank for the pic! It looks really enticing!
I'm not sure if it's as old as 1793, but I think is easily possible. As far as I can judge from that photo it is really something old. The last place I've seen something like that was on some medieval chest in Switzerland. Like from 1600's or so. I think that makes sense, since lock did not really evolve that fast in those times but shortly after in the later 1800's the lock evolution did begun to speed up.

I can understand that you didn't really care about it. After all a lock is primarily for locking :) as long as it does that, why bother?:)
I can't wait next year for the pics. (Deep-deep inside my secret wish is that you take it apart and make detailed photos. But then the stronger part of me overcomes and screams that such a historic piece of lock must not be hurt.It would be nothing less than heresy. It should be cared for and nurtured.:D So I don't even really dare to ask you to consider it. But still, see, I did.:) Though do consider it carefully. I would really hate to be the cause of the death of such a piece. After all it lived for 219 years. Who am I to risk it for my curiosity. Well I actually have nothing to do with it. It's your lock, all up to you.)
But anyway I hope summer comes early in Finland next year:D.

Though I definitely wouldn't risk hurting such an old lock with a pick, but I had some success with older hard to turn locks. I found that if you make the a few tools yourself based on a steel rectangle-shaped rod you can exert surprising amounts of force.The key is (:D) the handle.

EuropeanAmerican : sorry again for hacking your thread! If you have any further questions please ask them and I will do my best to answer them or look up the answer somewhere.:)
To infinity... and beyond!
ARF-GEF
 
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Re: European Key Question

Postby zeepia » 14 Oct 2013 9:53

Howdy again,
I thought not to start a new thread for this happy ending. So hijacking continues.
I was at our summer place and took some more pictures... and realised I have lied to you all. It´s from 1794 ;)

Image

Maybe I remembered that 25cm from my childhood :D

Image

Image

Image

You can see it has been quite a lot of use with this lock. There are two steps (two whole turns) to lock this fully. And latch which can open and lock this from inside without a key.
zeepia
 
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Re: European Key Question

Postby ARF-GEF » 14 Oct 2013 16:36

Ah I'm glad to see you again around here Zeepia :)

That is an ice very cool lock. I would totally put sth like that on my mancave. If I had one.. :D
1794 was not yesterday and still working :)
To infinity... and beyond!
ARF-GEF
 
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Joined: 26 Oct 2012 11:14
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Re: European Key Question

Postby GWiens2001 » 14 Oct 2013 17:21

Hey, Zeepia! Welcome back. Must be about snow-time there.

Beautiful example of old-world locksmithing. Do you oil the lock to protect it from the rain and snow? Any other maintenance?

Gordon
Just when you finally think you have learned it all, that is when you learn that you don't know anything yet.
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Re: European Key Question

Postby zeepia » 27 Oct 2013 13:54

Hi guys :)

We have totally mishandled that lock for years, maybe should give it some oil next summer...
luckily it´s not getting rain as it´s inside but still... poor lock... ;)
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