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hardplate, where can I purchase

Having read the FAQ's you are still unfulfilled and seek more enlightenment, so post your general lock picking questions here.
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Do not post safe related questions in this sub forum! Post them in This Old Safe

The sub forum you are currently in is for asking Beginner Hobby Lock Picking questions only.

hardplate, where can I purchase

Postby jeff77 » 11 May 2013 15:40

Hi,

First post...

I have an old safe that I would like to insert a piece of hard-plate between the lock and door. Can anyone recommend somewhere I can order a piece of hard-plate?

Lock is a 3330 style

Jeff
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Re: hardplate, where can I purchase

Postby fgarci03 » 11 May 2013 18:23

Hi Jeff, welcome! :D

I'm not sure what you mean with inserting a hard-plate between the lock and door. Could you explain a bit more?
Maybe an image could help! :mrgreen:
Go ahead, keep plugging away, picking on me! You will end up on bypass or with rigor mortise.
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Re: hardplate, where can I purchase

Postby cledry » 11 May 2013 18:52

fgarci03 wrote:Hi Jeff, welcome! :D

I'm not sure what you mean with inserting a hard-plate between the lock and door. Could you explain a bit more?
Maybe an image could help! :mrgreen:


Hard plate is commonly welded to the inside of a safe door to protect the lock that is mounted behind it from attack by drilling. Most hard plate simply slows the driller down a bit. Composites with a matrix are generally better.
Jim
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Re: hardplate, where can I purchase

Postby cledry » 11 May 2013 18:56

You can harden your own plate stock.
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Re: hardplate, where can I purchase

Postby jeff77 » 11 May 2013 19:51

The lock is mounted to a bracket that is offset about 1" behind the front face of the door, I saw a similar setup in the lock store, except a piece of hardplate was sandwiched between the lock and the bracket (held in place with the mounting screws of the lock).
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Re: hardplate, where can I purchase

Postby maintenanceguy » 11 May 2013 20:11

http://www.mcmaster.com/#steel-plates/=mpkn2j

This will give you an idea of the cost. This stuff is just about the same hardness as the hardest ball bearings.
-Ryan
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Re: hardplate, where can I purchase

Postby cledry » 11 May 2013 20:19

jeff77 wrote:The lock is mounted to a bracket that is offset about 1" behind the front face of the door, I saw a similar setup in the lock store, except a piece of hardplate was sandwiched between the lock and the bracket (held in place with the mounting screws of the lock).


Normally you don't want the lock screwed through the hard plate but on a separate piece or on stand-off tabs.
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Re: hardplate, where can I purchase

Postby GWiens2001 » 11 May 2013 21:19

Not to mention that the dial spindle would need to be longer, or it will not sufficiently reach through the door and additional plate into the lock itself. But good thinking on how to make your safe 'safer'.

Gordon
Just when you finally think you have learned it all, that is when you learn that you don't know anything yet.
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Re: hardplate, where can I purchase

Postby jeff77 » 12 May 2013 7:26

maintenanceguy wrote:http://www.mcmaster.com/#steel-plates/=mpkn2j

This will give you an idea of the cost. This stuff is just about the same hardness as the hardest ball bearings.


The link has a list of many types of steel, so I'm not sure which particular alloy your referring to. I called our local Metal Super Market and they can provide D2 cut to my desired dimensions. Not sure how tough D2 is compared to the real "hardplate" that the safe manufacturers are using? I guess it's better than nothing.

I'm starting to realize that simple safes are good for deterring the ham fisted thieves with a big hammer, however any serious "safe cracker" can get into almost any safe via knowledge and technology.
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Re: hardplate, where can I purchase

Postby ARF-GEF » 12 May 2013 8:02

Are you from the US or from the EU?
in Europe we there is very handy categorisation of safes ranging from S1,S2 which give acceptable but limited protection (Standard: EN 14450) to Safes marked from Grade 0 to Grade VI (EN 1143-1). Vaults go all the way up to XII.
Those come very handy when you need to decide what protection level does the safe offer.
Maybe you can find out the applicable EN category even if you buy it in the US. It should greatly help you with choosing and comparing them :)

I'm starting to realize that simple safes are good for deterring the ham fisted thieves with a big hammer, however any serious "safe cracker" can get into almost any safe via knowledge and technology.

Yes. With necessary time, knowledge, money and determination any safe can be cracked. It ist just a question how much of those do you need :)

Not sure how tough D2 is compared to the real "hardplate" that the safe manufacturers are using?


In safes the strength of the door /walls are measured in RU (resistance units I believe). I think that should be a valid direction to look into when comparing materials.
The European standards require safes all the way up from S1 to defend the lock with a plate with the minimal hardness of 60 HRC. So that should give you some comparison. :)
To infinity... and beyond!
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Re: hardplate, where can I purchase

Postby jeff77 » 14 May 2013 18:51

Thanks for the information. Another member had some surplus hard plate, so I will be using that when it arrives.
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