Fontaine Pump Lock

[MrAnybody]

I've recently got hold of a Fontaine lock, and I was wondering if any of you out there has any experience picking this type of lock. I'd really appreciate any tips or info you may have.

I've also no idea when this lock was in circulation.

As you may know, Fontaine is a French lock maker. Apparently, this type of lock is used for some sort of pumping station / facility or equipment. The lock type is known as an Umbrella Lock.

So far, I have one small source of info here from Rickthepick. He links his blog entry in a lp101 post here.

I'm looking to collect any info/know-how you may have, especially on how I'm going to tension and pick this little puppy.

I'll update with any progress I make myself.

Many thanks.

[phrygianradar]

Hey MrAnybody, sweet score on that lock! If you have tons of money laying around and you just don't know what to do with it all , they make a pick for the Fontaine lock;

http://www.multipick-service.com/htdocs ... parapluie/

Not cheap to say the least, looks similar to a seven pin tubular lock, though. Hope you can get it picked; it will be interesting to see how one goes about it... without spending a truck load of money.

[MacGyver101]

Hrm... interesting. I'd heard "pump lock" referred to before, in the context of French locks, and I always assumed that they were called "pump locks" because of the way you pressed the key into the lock body (rather than it being a "lock for pumps")? (I'm very likely mistaken, though!)

[ARF-GEF]

Pump locks are used as a synonym for push locks. I think the nomenclature is not unified.
So to make it even murkier I think the lock MrA posted is also called pump lock...

Mottura (And ISEO also) has push lock which are also called pump-mechanism locks:
here a vid of picking it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v9KLoBgrjHU
If someone speak italian he coudl sum up if he says anything interesting



Mottura

Iseo
It's rather rare so not too many good pictures are out there. There is a section about it in Graham Pulford's High security mechanic locks and Encyclopaedic reference.

[phrygianradar]

[quote="ARF-GEF
If someone speak italian he coudl sum up if he says anything interesting
[/quote]

I'm pretty sure it is in Spanish. Which is good because I work with a lot of native Spanish speakers (I speak enough to get a grasp of what he is saying but not the technical details), I will ask on of the guys to watch it. Cool video none-the-less. I have never seen a lock like that. And I liked all the trash and bubble wrap piled up in the backround, had a nice ambiance. Good "road apples"!

[phrygianradar]

Sorry, it is not Spanish! My bad. Probably should have had my coffee before putting my foot in my mouth this morning!

[MrAnybody]

Pump locks are used as a synonym for push locks. I think the nomenclature is not unified.
So to make it even murkier I think the lock MrA posted is also called pump lock...

Mottura (And ISEO also) has push lock which are also called pump-mechanism locks:
here a vid of picking it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v9KLoBgrjHU
If someone speak italian he coudl sum up if he says anything interesting



Mottura

Iseo
It's rather rare so not too many good pictures are out there. There is a section about it in Graham Pulford's High security mechanic locks and Encyclopaedic reference.

As always, ARF, you come up with such interesting stuff! Very cool, indeed.

And I'm beginning to think you're perfectly right in saying that the word 'pump' is referring to the type of lock rather than the use of the lock.

Great research, ARF. Many thanks, my friend.

[MrAnybody]

Hey MrAnybody, sweet score on that lock! If you have tons of money laying around and you just don't know what to do with it all , they make a pick for the Fontaine lock;

http://www.multipick-service.com/htdocs ... parapluie/

Not cheap to say the least, looks similar to a seven pin tubular lock, though. Hope you can get it picked; it will be interesting to see how one goes about it... without spending a truck load of money.

Yep, I saw that pick. Take a look here: http://youtu.be/s7BSs89j0ls It's a homebrew version that is - no doubt - a whole lot easier on the wallet.

My main challenge at the moment is how I'm gonna tension this little puppy. It's definitely going to have to be a homebrew creation, but I think it will just be a tension tool rather than a decoder. Picking should (*cough*) be fine with that in place

[ARF-GEF]

Lol no problem about the language mixup phyringe!
I don't speak either so I have trouble telling them apart

Yes, the motturas are very cool, but also a pricey.
I'm sorry that I could not find anything more closely related to your locks MrA. I think your kind is only used in France and I don't speak french :S

I have one and disassembled it. (see a bit of detaisl about the mechanism below) I screwed up and then there was a piece I couldn't put back. There was 1 spring which I still had, but I had no idea where to put it.

So I had to go to the local mottura and they charged me like 20$ for the 25 seconds work of putting the single spring it back to it's place.

And it was literally 25sec. I unscrewed 3 of the 4 screws holding it
so it was like 5s for that lone screw, 2 s for opening the "lid" 6 seconds of measuring up the situation and the another 6 seconds grabbing the spring and putting it back in place. Then he had 2 seconds to place the lid back on and like 5 second putting that single screw back.

If I could help a fellow lock enthusiast with such small work I would surely do it for free. Gladly.
Man that kind of easy, under 30seconds work I would do for free for anyone!
I would even be happy that I met someone who is so interested in locks that he decided to take it apart.
Heck I probably would whip up a small presentation of the lock (for free naturally) if he were interested. Happily and gladly...
He even knows I part time work for a fellow locksmith so I'm even pretty much a colleague. And this is a small, closed community.
So 20$ (which us bigger money here) for that kind of work, considering all that... I actually got a bit angry for the "leeching"...
Anyway they just made a big step to further their name as a shamelessly overcharging place...
Or what to the pro lockies think about it? Is it just me?

So back to the mottura lock I've taken apart.

It's basically a lever lock with the levers being axially pushed. They have a sidebar to make individual manipulation harder. Spring tension is astonishingly high... No macs on the levers, so that's good but only like 5 of them :S
The middle lever is not coded it's the one which actuates everything.
For further pics and details: Graham Pulford's High security mechanic locks and Encyclopaedic reference page 255

[phrygianradar]

Hey MrAnybody, sweet score on that lock! If you have tons of money laying around and you just don't know what to do with it all , they make a pick for the Fontaine lock;

http://www.multipick-service.com/htdocs ... parapluie/

Not cheap to say the least, looks similar to a seven pin tubular lock, though. Hope you can get it picked; it will be interesting to see how one goes about it... without spending a truck load of money.

Yep, I saw that pick. Take a look here: http://youtu.be/s7BSs89j0ls It's a homebrew version that is - no doubt - a whole lot easier on the wallet.

My main challenge at the moment is how I'm gonna tension this little puppy. It's definitely going to have to be a homebrew creation, but I think it will just be a tension tool rather than a decoder. Picking should (*cough*) be fine with that in place

That was a really cool home made tool he had. Zeepia made a really cool tensioner for a strange dimple lock here;

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=46474&p=416478&hilit=unusual+dimple+lock#p416478

I wonder if something like that (similar, not the same at all, I know) would work on your Fontaine. If it were tube shaped, it could tensioned with with one bar and you could pick through the middle maybe?

[seb0704]

hello
this fontaine lock is not to much in use in France yet. some other are more popular as Pollux, Mottura,Picard,Iseo...
however it's not Multipick who manufactures parapluie. he is a reseller.
regards

[ARF-GEF]

Ah, thanks seb! It's always good to see French lockies around Especially English speaking ones! Welcome to the forum!
Thanks for the info by the way.

[seb0704]

Hello ARF-GEF
i thank you very much.
the french companie is called Madelin and his website is http://www.madelin-sa.com
just have a look on their parapluie
regards

[FrenchKey]

Hello,

This lock is quite old but still in use in some universities, Electrical stations, cities and houses.
It usely as no false gate, making it quite easy to pick (given you can tension it )

The real pain is that you may need to pick it 6 or 8 times to make a whole turn.

For the tensioning itself, a piano wire bent U-shape is generally enough.

Parapluies (umbrellas) can be necessary for some locks, but not this one
and yes, we call it a pump lock ("serrure à pompe" in french)

Have Fun

FrenchKey

[seb0704]

Hello

As esplained by me and Frenchkey (nice to meet french people in this forum), this lock is old. The new generation has 7 pump and is called Dynaxys. http://www.denyfontaine.com/catalogue/c ... ine_37.pdf
regards