Hey all, could not really find much with the search so here I am. I'm starting to feel that I have become much more proficient with security pins, tough bittings, and restrictive key ways etc. I am in no way an expert but I would like to take it up a notch in difficulty as far as pin and tumbler locks are concerned. I'm looking for input about what locks with sidebars are recommended for someone who has not had much experience with them. Currently the only sidebar lock I have is an original 5 pin Medeco mortise lock. I have made good progress with it (still haven't gotten all 5 stacks yet) but couldn't help but wonder if there were any other locks I could benefit from at this point in the sidebar game. Thanks, any info is greatly appreciated = )
You could look for a Scorpion CX-5/Marks Hi-Security/ScanLock SL-5. It's 6 pins and 5 sliders with a sidebar. Not too bad and the mortise cylinders I have are setup for grub screws like Medeco so they are easy to work on if you want to start with less than a fully pinned lock.
You could also look at an ASSA Twin. Fully pinned with the 6 pins and 5 side/finger pins they are beyond my skill but I can do the 6 pins with no side pins or the 5 side pins with no regular pins. It's a decent way to learn some more advanced skills and hone your perception of what the lock tells you when you do sneaky things to it. These should all have barrel or funky spools and countermilling so it's a hell of a lock even without the sidebar components.
You could scavenge some old GM car door locks from junkyards or just off junkers on their way to the shredder. They are somewhat less complicated but are good for learning. Thats what I learned on back in the 70' s .
What is the best way to educate the masses? ... " A television in every home." What is the best way to control the masses? ... " A television in every room." From "Charlie" AKA " Flowers for Algernon"
Since I am a beginner, I really don't know anything about what you are asking, but I have a helpful tip.
Divinorum wrote:Hey all, could not really find much with the search so here I am.
If you meant that the forum search doesn't yield any results (which it really doesn't; it omits words for some reason), there is another way to search for posts in this forum (there is a good chance that you may already know this). In Google, you type (without the quotes and brackets): "site:lockpicking101.com [Your topic here]". It should search for all the posts related to your topic. I tried it with your topic, and i found some posts that should help. Try this one http://www.lockpicking101.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=54554
Hope this helped , like i said, you might know this already :p -Parkourer
"Some people dream of success, while others wake up and work hard at it" - Winston Churchhill
GWiens2001 wrote:Not pin tumbler, but the cheap disc detainer locks have sidebars. So do some of the Bell type bicycle locks.
Gordon
When I get a disk detainer pick I'll be sure to check those out.
spandexwarrior wrote:You could look for a Scorpion CX-5/Marks Hi-Security/ScanLock SL-5. It's 6 pins and 5 sliders with a sidebar. Not too bad and the mortise cylinders I have are setup for grub screws like Medeco so they are easy to work on if you want to start with less than a fully pinned lock.
You could also look at an ASSA Twin. Fully pinned with the 6 pins and 5 side/finger pins they are beyond my skill but I can do the 6 pins with no side pins or the 5 side pins with no regular pins. It's a decent way to learn some more advanced skills and hone your perception of what the lock tells you when you do sneaky things to it. These should all have barrel or funky spools and countermilling so it's a hell of a lock even without the sidebar components.
Does the Scorpion CX-5/Marks Hi-Security have a second set of pins on the side of the plug for the sidebar? The ASSA sounds similar to Medeco with the rotating pins.
smokingman wrote:You could scavenge some old GM car door locks from junkyards or just off junkers on their way to the shredder.
There's only a few Junk Yards close by but, I'll see what I can do.
If you meant that the forum search doesn't yield any results (which it really doesn't; it omits words for some reason), there is another way to search for posts in this forum (there is a good chance that you may already know this). In Google, you type (without the quotes and brackets): "site:lockpicking101.com [Your topic here]". It should search for all the posts related to your topic. I tried it with your topic, and i found some posts that should help. Try this one viewtopic.php?f=9&t=54554
Thanks, yes I always try searching this way. As you posted, there's a few threads about what a sidebar is but nothing on recommended beginner sidebar locks.
spandexwarrior wrote:You could look for a Scorpion CX-5/Marks Hi-Security/ScanLock SL-5. It's 6 pins and 5 sliders with a sidebar. Not too bad and the mortise cylinders I have are setup for grub screws like Medeco so they are easy to work on if you want to start with less than a fully pinned lock.
You could also look at an ASSA Twin. Fully pinned with the 6 pins and 5 side/finger pins they are beyond my skill but I can do the 6 pins with no side pins or the 5 side pins with no regular pins. It's a decent way to learn some more advanced skills and hone your perception of what the lock tells you when you do sneaky things to it. These should all have barrel or funky spools and countermilling so it's a hell of a lock even without the sidebar components.
Does the Scorpion CX-5/Marks Hi-Security have a second set of pins on the side of the plug for the sidebar? The ASSA sounds similar to Medeco with the rotating pins.
The Scorpion and it's clones have 5 sliders that move up and down only and align to allow a sidebar to drop into a slot in the slider.
Assa isn't really similar to Medeco except for the fact that it has a sidebar. All the Twin series have a 2nd set of finger pins/side pins inline next to the standard 6 pins. The Twin 6000 side pins just move up and down. After that, some of the models do position the tip of the finger pin fore or aft and others rotate the finger pin like the Schlage Primus (same designer). There are quite a few variations and all are slightly different Twin 6000, V-10, Combi, Twin Max, Twin Pro, etc. Han Fey has a great paper that covers most of them.
Thanks for the clarification spandexwarrior. I see Security Snobs has used ASSA twins at a very reasonable price. Is this the paper you are talking about?
Yep, that's the paper. And the Twin 6000 from Security Snobs would be a good lock to have to play with (good price also). I think I said this, but you can gut it and only leave the normal pins in and it's still a challenging lock. So there are lots of things you can do with it. Also, the TuBar and BiLock are sidebar locks also - different mechanisms but still a sidebar as one of the components. The TuBar you won't be able to disassemble without drilling out a pin and it won't be good for learning progressively. Not sure about the BiLock.
The BiLock is not an easy lock to pick. If you want to try picking it, it is best to make a tension wrench specifically for your BiLocks. Can a normal tension wrench work? Yes. But ask fgarci03 what can happen.
Gordon
Just when you finally think you have learned it all, that is when you learn that you don't know anything yet.
Not easy for sure, I didn't mean to imply that. I'm not sure you can even pin it up partially and have it still function properly so it's probably not good for a next step but it does have two sidebars.
Okay, I see the difference now. Gordon, do you think the ASSA Twin I posted above would be easier to pick then the BiLock and a good step to learning sidebars?
, like i said, you might know this already :p