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How Master-Keyed Wafer Locks Work

Information about locks themselves. Questions, tips and lock diagram information should be posted here.

Re: How Master-Keyed Wafer Locks Work

Postby minifhncc » 17 Jan 2013 7:06

globallockytoo wrote:it'd be smarter to use a system that cannot be picked easily or the master key determined easily, but cost is the underlying factor.

Another factor to consider is that usually mailbox locks being outside become heavily exposed to weather and eventually stop working. I don't think it's economically viable to replace a Bilock cam lock every few years...

realistically speaking, of course, if you are really concerned about protecting your mail, you arent going to do so using a wafer lock.

Yes, but most determined thieves wont pick locks.

What these thieves do is usually go around apartment blocks where the mailboxes are stacked up in one location. They then use a master key to open all of the locks systematically and dump it in a bag. They later sort the stolen mail at home and duly commit identity theft crimes.

The thieves aren't going to spend 1-2 minutes picking the lock, which in itself may be difficult because most mailbox locks are hardened due to weather exposure, and open 200 mailboxes in that matter when they can just use a master key and open the lock in a matter of seconds and sweep the whole lot of mailboxes in less than 20 minutes. Moreoever, the mailboxes are usually located in a public location where a person passing by could see them.

All in all, having a non MKed mailbox lock, here in Australia at least, considerably decreases the probability of mail theft.
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Re: How Master-Keyed Wafer Locks Work

Postby phoneman85 » 9 Jan 2014 21:55

Kudos man, I too have wondered how wafers are masterkeyed. is this the way all wafer locks are masterkeyed, or just this particular company?
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Re: How Master-Keyed Wafer Locks Work

Postby mechanical_nightmare » 27 Jan 2014 3:28

It has been a while since I first read this post, but came across a master-keyed wafer lock for the first time yesterday. I was confused for a little bit as the lock was already picked, and the plug couldn't be removed.

It turns out the plug can be rotated with all the wafers set except for the master/change wafer, and that is what holds the plug in place. I pounded the plug to remove it and destroyed the master wafer to remove the plug, as I didn't exactly know what was keeping it in place. (I thought it was some kind of retaining pin or circlip)

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Hopefully I can restore it to operating condition, but if not, no biggie...
If you do not manipulate the lock, then the lock will manipulate you
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Re: How Master-Keyed Wafer Locks Work

Postby billdeserthills » 24 Mar 2014 19:52

One of the neat things about locks is every manufacturer has a different patent, so their lock uses different perts or construction. The mailbox locks in the states are pin tumbler now, without a masterkey as the entire face of the mailbox is opened with the mailman's master (usually a Medeco key) that gives the mailman access to Every person's mail box at one time & eliminates the risk to individual person's mail as master keyed pin tumbler locks are easier to pick open
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Re: How Master-Keyed Wafer Locks Work

Postby globallockytoo » 25 Mar 2014 16:29

billdeserthills wrote:One of the neat things about locks is every manufacturer has a different patent, so their lock uses different perts or construction. The mailbox locks in the states are pin tumbler now, without a masterkey as the entire face of the mailbox is opened with the mailman's master (usually a Medeco key) that gives the mailman access to Every person's mail box at one time & eliminates the risk to individual person's mail as master keyed pin tumbler locks are easier to pick open


Medeco are definitely NOT used by the Post office or mailmen. Why would they use garbage?

I dont know where in the states you are but Medeco will never be used by any self respecting entity, intent on having security.
One One was a race horse, one one won one race, one two was a racehorse, one two won one too.

Disclaimer: Do not pull tag off mattress. Not responsible for legal advice while laughing.
Bilock - The Original True Bump Proof Pin Tumbler System!
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Re: How Master-Keyed Wafer Locks Work

Postby billdeserthills » 25 Mar 2014 16:54

globallockytoo wrote:
billdeserthills wrote:One of the neat things about locks is every manufacturer has a different patent, so their lock uses different perts or construction. The mailbox locks in the states are pin tumbler now, without a masterkey as the entire face of the mailbox is opened with the mailman's master (usually a Medeco key) that gives the mailman access to Every person's mail box at one time & eliminates the risk to individual person's mail as master keyed pin tumbler locks are easier to pick open


Medeco are definitely NOT used by the Post office or mailmen. Why would they use garbage?

I dont know where in the states you are but Medeco will never be used by any self respecting entity, intent on having security.



Well My mistake then, I always thought Medeco made good house locks, I have several
thousand $,$$$ worth in my vans just waiting to be installed. Why do you find them lacking?
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Re: How Master-Keyed Wafer Locks Work

Postby billdeserthills » 25 Mar 2014 17:30

I read the stuff on Medeco and I am surprised. I had always thought they made a strong,
quality product. I am sorry to hear they are so poorly constructed. Assa also owns a lock
company called Emtek. A crummier lock than that is rarely seen and the prices are terribly
high as well. I don't suppose ASSA has any plans to upgrade either company's product.
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Re: How Master-Keyed Wafer Locks Work

Postby Squelchtone » 25 Mar 2014 21:11

billdeserthills wrote:I read the stuff on Medeco and I am surprised. I had always thought they made a strong,
quality product. I am sorry to hear they are so poorly constructed. Assa also owns a lock
company called Emtek. A crummier lock than that is rarely seen and the prices are terribly
high as well. I don't suppose ASSA has any plans to upgrade either company's product.


ASSA is ASSA, they're in Sweden and make very nice locks, I know you mean ASSA Abloy Group, but let's call it by it's full name so non locksmiths and new members do not learn the wrong information.

I think global likes to hate medeco because it is talked about so much here. He likes Bilock above all other locks and that's totally fine, they make a good product. I think once you get to the $200 dollars a deadbolt club, all of the lock companies are pretty good. Are they perfect, no, of course not, and some weakness will always be found and talked about here or in the news, today it may be Medeco, tomorrow it may be Abloy or Mul-t-lock, maybe some day it will be Bilock's turn. no lock is perfect, but it sure beats not having a lock on your door, or having an old Kwikset.

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Re: How Master-Keyed Wafer Locks Work

Postby Squelchtone » 25 Mar 2014 21:14

globallockytoo wrote:
billdeserthills wrote:One of the neat things about locks is every manufacturer has a different patent, so their lock uses different perts or construction. The mailbox locks in the states are pin tumbler now, without a masterkey as the entire face of the mailbox is opened with the mailman's master (usually a Medeco key) that gives the mailman access to Every person's mail box at one time & eliminates the risk to individual person's mail as master keyed pin tumbler locks are easier to pick open


Medeco are definitely NOT used by the Post office or mailmen. Why would they use garbage?

I dont know where in the states you are but Medeco will never be used by any self respecting entity, intent on having security.


So that's why the White House uses Medeco? That's why the Nuclear Regulatory Commision uses Medeco on nuclear power plants? Just because the book came out and some very easy bypasses and tricks for Medeco Maxum deadbolts were released does not mean they affected every model and cylinder format Medeco sells, and it doesn't mean the problems were not eventually addressed. You make it sound like they are made out of pot metal and easier to pick than a Defiant home depot $10 dollar deadbolt. You need to get unstuck from this idea that Bilock is the only thing out there and everything else sucks. Sorry you invested a bunch of money into BiLock and hate everything else out there.. no need to poop on other Grade 1 locks by calling them garbage..

:roll:
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Re: How Master-Keyed Wafer Locks Work

Postby billdeserthills » 26 Mar 2014 1:33

I kinda looked into Bilock as a line of high security lock to stock in my shop, but
one thing I don't like about them is their latches and deadbolts/knobs all looked
to me like grade 2 import locks. I understand their prices reflect their lower cost
but in almost 25 years, nobody in my neck of the woods has managed to pick one
of the Medeco or ASSA locks I have installed. If you saw the homes & businesses I
service you would see why right away. Here in Arizona there is lots of glass everywhere
on homes & businesses. Thieves seem to really be against working hard and along
with all that glass are lots & lots of rocks. Why spend valuable time learning to pick
a specialty lock when with one throw of a rock you will have set off the same alarm
& gain entry as if you had picked the front door anyhow?
One of the best known criminals
in my part of the country was known as "The Rock Burglar" he was so named because
he used to make his entry through the little window in the master bathroom that the
alarm companies never bothered to alarm due to it's very small size. They would figure
No way is anyone gonna crawl through that little window-Well this guy would. For over 20
years he terrorized my area, stealing over $26 Million in jewelry and the cops out here still have
no idea quite how he managed to pull that off. I think he had a connection with an insurance
company because he never went into any other rooms in the places he burgled, only the master
bedroom & like I said he used to get into there via the master bathroom.
Thanks for explaining the misplaced hostility Squelchtone and I hope ya find a sucker, err I
mean client to dump the Bilocks on soon globallockytoo :lol:
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Re: How Master-Keyed Wafer Locks Work

Postby GWiens2001 » 26 Mar 2014 7:42

Am in the Tucson area, and the Post Office uses Medeco on all the drop-off boxes around here. The Post Office branch on Orange Grove uses Medeco on the doors, too. While the branch office on La Cañada uses Best on their doors, they still use Medeco on the drop boxes.

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Re: How Master-Keyed Wafer Locks Work

Postby Paleo123 » 26 Mar 2014 11:14

Bill your story about the "rock burglar" is hilarious...selling insurance for your stuff by day and then stealing said stuff by night :lol: :P After reading this I went to take a peek and the mail box bank for my mail has an Abloy, but either way(and I won't say impossible here)it is highly improbable that someone would ever be able to pick a Medeco lock on a mailbox bank in a period of time sufficiently short enough to go un-noticed. And because someone made plastic keys from pictures of keys doesn't change that. As for my personal mailbox its a 5-pin pin tumbler anybody who would like to steal my bills is welcome to them :lol: (gotta pay them though :P )
AC
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Re: How Master-Keyed Wafer Locks Work

Postby billdeserthills » 26 Mar 2014 14:54

GWiens2001 wrote:Am in the Tucson area, and the Post Office uses Medeco on all the drop-off boxes around here. The Post Office branch on Orange Grove uses Medeco on the doors, too. While the branch office on La Cañada uses Best on their doors, they still use Medeco on the drop boxes.

Gordon



Well then I don't suppose anyone has accused the USPS of being "a self respecting entity" :P
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Re: How Master-Keyed Wafer Locks Work

Postby YouLuckyFox » 26 Mar 2014 15:19

Paleo123 wrote:Bill your story about the "rock burglar" is hilarious...selling insurance for your stuff by day and then stealing said stuff by night :lol: :P After reading this I went to take a peek and the mail box bank for my mail has an Abloy, but either way(and I won't say impossible here)it is highly improbable that someone would ever be able to pick a Medeco lock on a mailbox bank in a period of time sufficiently short enough to go un-noticed. And because someone made plastic keys from pictures of keys doesn't change that. As for my personal mailbox its a 5-pin pin tumbler anybody who would like to steal my bills is welcome to them :lol: (gotta pay them though :P )


Reminds me of Charlie Chaplin's "The Kid." He repairs windows and has his kid go around throwing rocks through them.
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Re: How Master-Keyed Wafer Locks Work

Postby GWiens2001 » 26 Mar 2014 16:51

billdeserthills wrote:
GWiens2001 wrote:Am in the Tucson area, and the Post Office uses Medeco on all the drop-off boxes around here. The Post Office branch on Orange Grove uses Medeco on the doors, too. While the branch office on La Cañada uses Best on their doors, they still use Medeco on the drop boxes.

Gordon



Well then I don't suppose anyone has accused the USPS of being "a self respecting entity" :P


LMAO!!! You got that right, Bill. :D

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