Licensing Frustrations

[Divinorum]

I just want to vent this with people who will actually care for a change. I just had the worst imaginable experience with my local government while trying to get information about obtaining a locksmith license. I can't believe that they want people to live here or move here and start businesses after how difficult and frustrating they make it. I live in a state where there is no state law about locksmith licensing, instead some counties have passed laws regulating it. The one I live in is one of them.

So I start out with a Google search and find out the county consumer affairs division has a Licensing Bureau. I'm thinking perfect that must be the place. WRONG, they only handle Home Improvement and Taxi licenses. Could locksmith fall under home improvement I ask, nope it does not. So I ask who do I need to speak with. They direct me to the county clerks office. So I call the county clerk and guess what? They say they don't do licensing and tell me to call consumer affairs. LOL. I explain that consumer affairs routed me to them. They say well we don't do licensing, try calling your town. I explain it's a county law and has nothing to do with the town and the guy insists yes it does. So I call the town and........they have no idea about a locksmith license, go figure because it's not a town law it's a county law. After all that I ended up calling the county executives office to politely explain the unacceptable runaround experience I am having and how absurdly difficult it is to get a straight answer. The lady apologizes and puts me on hold for 15 min to come back and say no one knows who to contact and can they call me back.

I swear to god It feels like an episode of Parks and Recreation. My local government are a bunch of geniuses. "Hey, lets pass a law that requires them to get a license and then make it next to impossible to obtain, sounds like a great idea! Oh yea lets also make it expensive as #@&$!"

few /endrant I needed to get that out

If anyone else has had a similar experience I feel your pain

[IndigoChild]

My license experience was actually fairly pleasant. In fact I had it within 4 months of moving to Texas. Though my concern now is whether or not I can renew it. But I would suggest going to a local locksmith and explaining your situation that you are trying to get licensed but due to state regulations for the time being it has been rendered impossible for you. You might be able to get hired on temporarily to get you a license. Just an idea, I don't know how many locksmiths would be very receptive to a new guy coming in wanting his license. I know the shop I worked for was extremely competitive and have ran out several under qualified locksmiths in the area.

[Divinorum]

My license experience was actually fairly pleasant. In fact I had it within 4 months of moving to Texas. Though my concern now is whether or not I can renew it. But I would suggest going to a local locksmith and explaining your situation that you are trying to get licensed but due to state regulations for the time being it has been rendered impossible for you. You might be able to get hired on temporarily to get you a license. Just an idea, I don't know how many locksmiths would be very receptive to a new guy coming in wanting his license. I know the shop I worked for was extremely competitive and have ran out several under qualified locksmiths in the area.

That was a thought I had. Worth a try but, I don't really know how helpful they would be to help someone who would end up somewhat competing with them in the end. At least I think they would see it that way. I'm not exactly set on locksmith as a career but, I have learned a good amount (can do re keys, key cutting, lockouts, some master keying etc) and if I were to do some part time work on the side I was looking to do it legally with a license. Granted I still have a ton to learn and I wouldn't apply for the license for some time to come I just wanted to get the info so when I was ready I would know what to do.

[billdeserthills]

Wow what a pita,
In Arizona we don't have a locksmith license requirement, but some locksmiths will get a contractors license if they do jobs for over like $850. I never had that problem tho and since I don't do any electrical work I can't see what is in it for me to pay my county a pile of money in order to get a pretty piece of paper to hang on my wall. In fact locksmiths in this state generally do advertise as "Licensed, Bonded & Insured" but my license is a resale license the state & city have provided for a yearly fee. I am bonded through the National Safeman's Organization and I have a 2million dollar liability policy. If I were you I would wait for them to come to me with their license scheme, the whole thing sounds like a scam to me.

[Paleo123]

Classic inept government employees But seriously that sounds like a bunch of bs I would be fairly vexed

[Evan]

Wow what a pita,
In Arizona we don't have a locksmith license requirement, but some locksmiths will get a contractors license if they do jobs for over like $850. I never had that problem tho and since I don't do any electrical work I can't see what is in it for me to pay my county a pile of money in order to get a pretty piece of paper to hang on my wall. In fact locksmiths in this state generally do advertise as "Licensed, Bonded & Insured" but my license is a resale license the state & city have provided for a yearly fee. I am bonded through the National Safeman's Organization and I have a 2million dollar liability policy. If I were you I would wait for them to come to me with their license scheme, the whole thing sounds like a scam to me.

They go for the contractor's license because it allows them to place a tradesman's lien against the real estate in the case of an unpaid bill a lot more easily than it would otherwise be if you were totally unlicensed...

~~ Evan

[Evan]

So I start out with a Google search and find out the county consumer affairs division has a Licensing Bureau. I'm thinking perfect that must be the place. WRONG, they only handle Home Improvement and Taxi licenses. Could locksmith fall under home improvement I ask, nope it does not. So I ask who do I need to speak with. They direct me to the county clerks office. So I call the county clerk and guess what? They say they don't do licensing and tell me to call consumer affairs. LOL. I explain that consumer affairs routed me to them. They say well we don't do licensing, try calling your town. I explain it's a county law and has nothing to do with the town and the guy insists yes it does. So I call the town and........they have no idea about a locksmith license, go figure because it's not a town law it's a county law. After all that I ended up calling the county executives office to politely explain the unacceptable runaround experience I am having and how absurdly difficult it is to get a straight answer. The lady apologizes and puts me on hold for 15 min to come back and say no one knows who to contact and can they call me back.

Since locksmithing is closely related to public safety and the prevention of crime, in many areas where it is regulated by individual counties and NOT handled by a county-wide licensing bureau, I would contact the County Sheriff's office...

As far as your "runaround" experience ? From your viewpoint you did nothing wrong, however from other viewpoints you asked an unanswerable question of agencies who aren't responsible for that specific function... You wouldn't go to the DMV for instance and ask environmental questions about forestry practices in state parks...

~~ Evan

[billdeserthills]

I just want to vent this with people who will actually care for a change. I just had the worst imaginable experience with my local government while trying to get information about obtaining a locksmith license. I can't believe that they want people to live here or move here and start businesses after how difficult and frustrating they make it. I live in a state where there is no state law about locksmith licensing, instead some counties have passed laws regulating it. The one I live in is one of them.

So I start out with a Google search and find out the county consumer affairs division has a Licensing Bureau. I'm thinking perfect that must be the place. WRONG, they only handle Home Improvement and Taxi licenses. Could locksmith fall under home improvement I ask, nope it does not. So I ask who do I need to speak with. They direct me to the county clerks office. So I call the county clerk and guess what? They say they don't do licensing and tell me to call consumer affairs. LOL. I explain that consumer affairs routed me to them. They say well we don't do licensing, try calling your town. I explain it's a county law and has nothing to do with the town and the guy insists yes it does. So I call the town and........they have no idea about a locksmith license, go figure because it's not a town law it's a county law. After all that I ended up calling the county executives office to politely explain the unacceptable runaround experience I am having and how absurdly difficult it is to get a straight answer. The lady apologizes and puts me on hold for 15 min to come back and say no one knows who to contact and can they call me back.

few /endrant I needed to get that out

So did they ever call you back?

Really tho Divinorum, the city of NY is just gonna take whatever money you give them
and give it to some welfare mom with 9 kids who prolly drives a cadillac, so why bother?

[Divinorum]

I just want to vent this with people who will actually care for a change. I just had the worst imaginable experience with my local government while trying to get information about obtaining a locksmith license. I can't believe that they want people to live here or move here and start businesses after how difficult and frustrating they make it. I live in a state where there is no state law about locksmith licensing, instead some counties have passed laws regulating it. The one I live in is one of them.

So I start out with a Google search and find out the county consumer affairs division has a Licensing Bureau. I'm thinking perfect that must be the place. WRONG, they only handle Home Improvement and Taxi licenses. Could locksmith fall under home improvement I ask, nope it does not. So I ask who do I need to speak with. They direct me to the county clerks office. So I call the county clerk and guess what? They say they don't do licensing and tell me to call consumer affairs. LOL. I explain that consumer affairs routed me to them. They say well we don't do licensing, try calling your town. I explain it's a county law and has nothing to do with the town and the guy insists yes it does. So I call the town and........they have no idea about a locksmith license, go figure because it's not a town law it's a county law. After all that I ended up calling the county executives office to politely explain the unacceptable runaround experience I am having and how absurdly difficult it is to get a straight answer. The lady apologizes and puts me on hold for 15 min to come back and say no one knows who to contact and can they call me back.

few /endrant I needed to get that out

So did they ever call you back?

Really tho Divinorum, the city of NY is just gonna take whatever money you give them
and give it to some welfare mom with 9 kids who prolly drives a cadillac, so why bother?

I never said it was the city and no they never called me back

Since locksmithing is closely related to public safety and the prevention of crime, in many areas where it is regulated by individual counties and NOT handled by a county-wide licensing bureau, I would contact the County Sheriff's office...

As far as your "runaround" experience ? From your viewpoint you did nothing wrong, however from other viewpoints you asked an unanswerable question of agencies who aren't responsible for that specific function... You wouldn't go to the DMV for instance and ask environmental questions about forestry practices in state parks..."

Thanks for the advice I'll try them next. To address what you have said, if someone want's to get a license it should not be difficult to get information about how to it. I was able to find information on how to get a taxi, limousine, and home improvement license within minutes of searching. That's the way it should be. The county has a website and they put on the website all the information. But when it comes to the locksmith license that they made people obligated to get by law, there is not 1 mention of the license on their website. The only thing I could find was a excerpt of the law itself which says nothing specific about who will handle the licensing.

So how did I ask unanswerable questions? I called the county licensing bureau to ask about a locksmith license....and the lady confidently told me to call the county clerks office. If there is not a shred of information available about obtaining a licensee what else I am supposed to do? So I did what I was told and followed their advice. I don't believe I can be at fault in this situation for following THEIR instructions and doing what they said to do. I did not just go around calling agencies demanding information. I called the people the county itself recommended i called and every time I explained so forwarded me to you. To compare this to calling the DMV to asking about forest laws is really extreme.

[Raymond]

On computer go to your State government page and search for locksmith licensing. I might be connected with alarm providers or security guards.

Search for the State or local locksmith organization active in that area. ALOA is a national organization and usually has State branches.

Look for active LP101 members in your State or city and join them.

Go into any locksmith shop and look at the licensing certificate, that they are probably required by law to post, and see which agency is responsible for supervising them and who to contact in case of a complaint.

You seem frustrated because you are just circling around the subject instead of diving directly into.

[Divinorum]

On computer go to your State government page and search for locksmith licensing. I might be connected with alarm providers or security guards.

Search for the State or local locksmith organization active in that area. ALOA is a national organization and usually has State branches.

Look for active LP101 members in your State or city and join them.

Go into any locksmith shop and look at the licensing certificate, that they are probably required by law to post, and see which agency is responsible for supervising them and who to contact in case of a complaint.

You seem frustrated because you are just circling around the subject instead of diving directly into.

Diving in to get the information is exactly what I was trying to do. I made phone call after phone call and searched the web for a while......I'm frustrated because the government that is in charge of the licensing does not provided any information to the people as to how to get this license as they have with every other license they offer. That is their job and they are failing to do it. It's not a state license so the state website has no information on it. I ended up talking with a locksmith that I was refereed to by a family friend and he gave me some information so I can try again on Monday. Thanks everyone for the participation in this thread. I apologize if I came off as shooting down the advice I was given, that was not my intentions. I admint that my frustrations get the best of me sometimes

[billdeserthills]

I understand New York has a new program they recently set in place to lure new business, using tax free incentives for ten years!
Jump on that!

[GWiens2001]

Nooooo, thanks.

Gordon

[Eyes_Only]

Since locksmithing is closely related to public safety and the prevention of crime, in many areas where it is regulated by individual counties and NOT handled by a county-wide licensing bureau, I would contact the County Sheriff's office...

As far as your "runaround" experience ? From your viewpoint you did nothing wrong, however from other viewpoints you asked an unanswerable question of agencies who aren't responsible for that specific function... You wouldn't go to the DMV for instance and ask environmental questions about forestry practices in state parks..."

So how did I ask unanswerable questions? I called the county licensing bureau to ask about a locksmith license....and the lady confidently told me to call the county clerks office. If there is not a shred of information available about obtaining a licensee what else I am supposed to do? So I did what I was told and followed their advice. I don't believe I can be at fault in this situation for following THEIR instructions and doing what they said to do. I did not just go around calling agencies demanding information. I called the people the county itself recommended i called and every time I explained so forwarded me to you. To compare this to calling the DMV to asking about forest laws is really extreme.

Welcome to LP101 and to the world of locksmithing Divinorum. I see you've already met Evan.

I did a google search on this too, cos I was curious. This site seemed to offer some leads, but it sounds like you've already gone down that rabbit hole. http://www.nyc.gov/html/dca/html/licenses/062.shtml

There may be two other ways to get some assistance. Try to see if a NY State Locksmith Association meeting closest to you would be willing to let a new comer sit in on a meeting, and then ask the attendees about any questions you have. http://www.mfsales.com/associat.html I can't guarantee that they will be helpful though. I've heard that the locksmith industry in NY can be kind of a jerk. This is what I did when I had questions about licensing in my state, and helped me out a lot.

If that doesn't work out contacting ALOA or SOPL might be worth a shot too. http://www.aloa.org/index.html http://www.sopl.us/

Best of luck! I hope this works out for you.

[Divinorum]

Since locksmithing is closely related to public safety and the prevention of crime, in many areas where it is regulated by individual counties and NOT handled by a county-wide licensing bureau, I would contact the County Sheriff's office...

As far as your "runaround" experience ? From your viewpoint you did nothing wrong, however from other viewpoints you asked an unanswerable question of agencies who aren't responsible for that specific function... You wouldn't go to the DMV for instance and ask environmental questions about forestry practices in state parks..."

So how did I ask unanswerable questions? I called the county licensing bureau to ask about a locksmith license....and the lady confidently told me to call the county clerks office. If there is not a shred of information available about obtaining a licensee what else I am supposed to do? So I did what I was told and followed their advice. I don't believe I can be at fault in this situation for following THEIR instructions and doing what they said to do. I did not just go around calling agencies demanding information. I called the people the county itself recommended i called and every time I explained so forwarded me to you. To compare this to calling the DMV to asking about forest laws is really extreme.

Welcome to LP101 and to the world of locksmithing Divinorum. I see you've already met Evan.

I did a google search on this too, cos I was curious. This site seemed to offer some leads, but it sounds like you've already gone down that rabbit hole. http://www.nyc.gov/html/dca/html/licenses/062.shtml

There may be two other ways to get some assistance. Try to see if a NY State Locksmith Association meeting closest to you would be willing to let a new comer sit in on a meeting, and then ask the attendees about any questions you have. http://www.mfsales.com/associat.html I can't guarantee that they will be helpful though. I've heard that the locksmith industry in NY can be kind of a jerk. This is what I did when I had questions about licensing in my state, and helped me out a lot.

If that doesn't work out contacting ALOA or SOPL might be worth a shot too. http://www.aloa.org/index.html http://www.sopl.us/

Best of luck! I hope this works out for you.

Eyes thanks very much for your reply. I have since solved this mystery but will consider the advice you have given. It turned out that the licensing bureau was the right place to call, but the person I spoke with on the phone had the wrong information and sent me on a wild goose chase. I called back a few weeks later following the advice I was given from another smith and explained again and they transferred me to the "person who had been in the office the longest" and she was much more helpful. They do indeed handle the locksmith license however......even though the law that requires licensing was passed 10 years ago.......there is still NO application or paperwork to apply for the license. Hence why when you search their website for information about the license there is none and when you call up (unless you are persistent and have done research) they just say no we don't handle that.

The excuse was because their workforce had been cut and they barley had enough people to keep on top of the already existing licenses and renewals let alone add an entire new trade into the mix. I asked how this could happen and could it be held against me that I don't have a license. She said that even though the law requires a license, I do not need one at the moment because it is impossible to apply for and that cant be held against me. As far as how this happened in the first place she said that the politicians like to pass feel good laws such as this one, without consulting to see if they have the resources. Very poor planning but what more can we expect from politicians. I still swear this entire situation was straight out of a parks and recreation episode.