master key fees?

[1mrchristopher]

I have an upcoming job, rekeying the municipal swimming pool. Master keyed, seven cylinders, sticking with the 5 pin Russwin D1 keyway cylinders that are in place (already ordered neuter bow nickel silver blanks). 3 panic devices, the remainder old Russwin knobs. The job will be done on sight.

Trying to get a better idea of pricing breakdown, how does something along these lines sound?

Service call: $45.00
Master-pin cylinder: $20.00, qty 7.
Keys: $4.50 ea.

Would you charge additionally for working on panic devices?
Am I missing anything else?

[victorylocksmith]

I say you garage them way more per key an the total of the job should be $350-$500. If thy can afford a big liability and luxury of a pool, it's time to cash in big. With the keys, they should be DND and you should charge them way more for them because it is on the master key code system.

[1mrchristopher]

garage them way more per key

I'm going to need an explanation of that term in this usage. Where I'm from we only garage cars, bicycles, that sort of thing, not generally people.

[1mrchristopher]

I should have stated that the keys are incised Do Not Duplicate, I will stamp them with my name/phone number stamp and also serialize them.

[victorylocksmith]

Gauge the garage

[1mrchristopher]

I'm really sorry Victory, I'm just not following you.

[cledry]

I don't feel it good business practice to gouge one customer just because they look as though they can afford to pay more.

Our policy has been to use set prices. We charge $60 trip charge for any call in a 25 mile radius. We charge $12.50 to MK a cylinder if there is an existing key available. In the case of your job we would charge $3.50 a key for nickel silver blanks and we would charge additional labour for panic bars based on an hourly rate in 1/2 hour increments, so if each bar took 10 minutes to remove the cylinder and reinstall then we would be over the 30 minute mark and it would be an hour labour or $55.

[1mrchristopher]

I don't feel it good business practice to gouge one customer just because they look as though they can afford to pay more.

I am in complete agreement. The city of Sidney, Montana, the municipality of which I was speaking, and the city in which I live (which by all rights is a glorified town, maybe 6,000 residents), is dealing with some financial issues as it stands, but even if they weren't, I would never stick it to them just because I thought they could pay. My business motto is "Honest, friendly service." To gouge anyone, I feel is neither honest nor friendly. At the end of the day 3 things have to happen: The job has to get done, the customer has to be satisfied, and I have to make money. Any one of those not happening, and I've just hurt my business instead of building it. If the customer understands that while the bill may seem a little high as compared to other services they might pay for, I am actually being very reasonable, then I'm more likely to have repeat business and referrals -- That's my take on it anyway.

The reason I put the key price where I did was simply because of the fact that they want x number of key A, y number of key B, z number of key C, and all keys numbered so that they can keep track of them. As they will be assigning keys to lifegaurds and other staff, they are happy to pay a bit more, so that they can honestly say when they hand them a key: "This is an expensive key, and if you lose it, you will have to pay for a new one." Also, in the past employees were taking their keys down to the hardware store and having copies made, so I specifically ordered neuter bow blanks just for this job. I could see dropping it to $4.00 even, but I think $3.50 might not be quite enough.

[cledry]

It depends on many factors what you charge for neuter bow blanks. I only charge $2.50 but this is for two reasons. Firstly they are coined with our name and phone number, so I also look at them as advertising which helps offset some cost. Secondly we buy in bulk, rarely less than 1000 at a time except for uncommon keyways and often for common keyways 5000 at a time. We actually pay less for neuter bow keys than many sectional keys.

We charge @ 45 cents to stamp keys unless they are code keys when the stamping of the code is included. We had to implement this as people were bring in keys they had cut themselves and wanting them stamped, plus our stamping machine costs more than many key machines, so we need to recoup some of the expense.

[globallockytoo]

since when has or does "DND stop any key cutter from duplicating a non-restricted keyway?

[1mrchristopher]

since when has or does "DND stop any key cutter from duplicating a non-restricted keyway?

Well Globallockytoo, of course marking keys "Do Not Duplicate," doesn't stop anyone from duplicating the key, inasmuch as that it does not carry with it any legal ramifications. That said, most high school students are unaware that they can run down to the hardware store with a key marked as such and have a gross of them cut, if they have the time and the money. Fortuitously city swimming pool lifeguards, and general employees are almost all high school students. Furthermore, I was specifically asked by the client for keys marked "Do Not Duplicate," even though one of the two clients cuts keys in his shop, and knows that it doesn't stop most people (he refuses to cut them), elsewise I likely wouldn't have bothered. The neuter bow is far more useful for limiting 5 and dime duplication, because 95% of the people cutting keys in those stores are reliant on the shape of the bow and/or the manufacturer code stamped on the bow.

I don't think that anyone implied at any point in this thread that having the key stamped as such was going to prevent duplication, although I note that Victorylocksmith, like my client, felt that they should be marked as such.

[billdeserthills]

since when has or does "DND stop any key cutter from duplicating a non-restricted keyway?

Actually here where I live, no home depot, lowes, wal-mart or ace hdwr will copy a key stamped Do Not Duplicate.

[cledry]

since when has or does "DND stop any key cutter from duplicating a non-restricted keyway?

Actually here where I live, no home depot, lowes, wal-mart or ace hdwr will copy a key stamped Do Not Duplicate.

Perhaps but will they peel off the sticker that says Fred's office to see if it says Do Not Duplicate underneath?

[Sinifar]

If you are asking how much do I charge? That depends on your own local situation. In a large city, fee can be higher. In a small town they have to be lower. It depends on the local economy.

BUT to get a good idea of what it takes. get the National Locksmith Flat Rate Manual, and work out your own prices, and stick with them. Adjust them as the economy goes up and down as needed. You can buy National Locksmith book from them, try the internet.

In time things will turn around. See my other post to you.

Sinifar

[smathis]

We charge $17.00 for MK per lock, more for exit devices. I agree tho whether the lock had 4 pins or 2 pins, it's your responsibility as the last one to touch it to make it right and bring it back to spec. There is a better chance for a "ghost key" (a key not in the master key sytem) to work when you use less pins.