Commando Lock, Bump Proof?

[Divinorum]

While surfing the commando lock website I came across something interesting I wanted to share and see what everyone's feedback is. Commando Lock states on their website that .....

"All Commando Locks are loaded with high security pins to resist surreptitious entry (lock picking) and are shim proof and bump proof per ASTM F883-09 testing requirements and cannot be bypassed by any means. "
http://www.commandolock.com/collections/ichange-lock

and

"To date the Commando equivalent (of the American 5200) has never been successfully bumped online...but you know us--we encourage you to exploit our failures so we can improve them."
http://www.commandolock.com/blogs/news- ... -the-field

Now, all commando locks have the same ASTM rating as the American 5200 equivalent which they boast has never been bumped online. This rating claims that "after 360 attempts, the lock cannot be bumped."

From my research using the commando locks I have recently purchased, they are indeed bumpable and very far from bump proof. They don't even seem to be bump resistant ie. no special bump resistant pins or anything like that. As we all know there is a big difference in something being bump proof vs bump resistant or pick proof vs pick resistant. Even most high security lock company's will not claim their locks are proof anything because there is always a chance, even if very very small, that the lock can be compromised.

So what gives? Either I am completely missing part of this puzzle or commando locks has some explaining to do. TIA looking forward to seeing what everyone has to say.

EDIT: Corrected thread title to "Commando" instead of "Command" based on the OP's post. -GWiens2001

[deolslyfox]

I think Commando and Paclock are going after Master's business base .... Both are "listening" the locksport community and are making improvement to their product lines.

I haven't worked with any of the new Commando / Paclock products yet, so I have zero first-hand information ....

Take a look at this video ....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=p ... 0IwDbwRQhw

[Divinorum]

I am a fan of commando lock for this exact reason. They actually listen to the lock sport community and want to improve their products. They are about more than cheap manufacturing and making a buck. As they said "we encourage you to exploit our failures so we can improve them." This is the reason for my post From where I'm standing, their claim of bump proof is flimsy at best. I had a hard time bumping a master lock with a bump stop pin than the commando locks I have.

[Valdo]

I am a fan of commando lock for this exact reason. They actually listen to the lock sport community and want to improve their products.

Getting a little off topic but I concur Divinorum, other lock manufacturer like Vachette actually refuse to have their name on any Lockpicking forum, it's not a problem here since you don't see a lot of their locks, but on my other forum, we have a filter that replace their name because they asked for it.

[GWiens2001]

I don't have much experience bumping locks, but do know that Commando Lock Company is very serious about having we in the Locksport community try to find weaknesses in their products and bring those weaknesses to their attention. They also ask for our input on ideas for improving their products. If you have a suggestion for improving the bump resistance for CLC, email them! Patrick Smith (president of the company) will most likely personally respond to you.

There have been several suggestions from the locksport community which they have already implemented to improve their products.

You have been bumping the locks? If so, please post a video, and send them a link. They truly want to make a better product.

Gordon

[jeffmoss26]

Here is the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-yyllJ0 ... ploademail

[deolslyfox]

Here's the reply from Commando Lock which goes to prove that CLC IS listening to the locksport community (and others) is IS making a genuine effort to improve their product !! And it is proof positive that they are indeed watching the internet and other media to see what people are saying about their products.

Kudus to CLC !! JMHO ....

commandolockcompany

8 hours ago

Outstanding! Please email me the number on your key so I can see which system is inside that cylinder. I have been waiting for someone to post a good bump video of our locks. You even held it in your hand instead of in a vice as do others. As with picking, the bitting has much to do with the action and the bump resistance will vary. Some will fail faster than others and some will pass. We hope to release our newest version later this year. Thanks for posting.

[GWiens2001]

Here's the reply from Commando Lock which goes to prove that CLC IS listening to the locksport community (and others) is IS making a genuine effort to improve their product !! And it is proof positive that they are indeed watching the internet and other media to see what people are saying about their products.

Kudus to CLC !! JMHO ....

commandolockcompany

8 hours ago

Outstanding! Please email me the number on your key so I can see which system is inside that cylinder. I have been waiting for someone to post a good bump video of our locks. You even held it in your hand instead of in a vice as do others. As with picking, the bitting has much to do with the action and the bump resistance will vary. Some will fail faster than others and some will pass. We hope to release our newest version later this year. Thanks for posting.

I told you so! They (CLC) is serious about getting good input from the locksport community to improve their product. As usual, am impressed with the attitude they show.

Gordon

[Divinorum]

Here's the reply from Commando Lock which goes to prove that CLC IS listening to the locksport community (and others) is IS making a genuine effort to improve their product !! And it is proof positive that they are indeed watching the internet and other media to see what people are saying about their products.

Kudus to CLC !! JMHO ....

commandolockcompany

8 hours ago

Outstanding! Please email me the number on your key so I can see which system is inside that cylinder. I have been waiting for someone to post a good bump video of our locks. You even held it in your hand instead of in a vice as do others. As with picking, the bitting has much to do with the action and the bump resistance will vary. Some will fail faster than others and some will pass. We hope to release our newest version later this year. Thanks for posting.

So you sent them the video posted above already? Who should I email the bitting to?

[deolslyfox]

CLC actually monitors YouTube and various "lock-centric" forums such as this one for comments / videos concerning their products. They also have "field testers" who are known and respected in the community. They sent pre-production / prototype locks for evaluation prior to final production and release.

These guys are doing it right !!

You can get their address from the website. http://www.commandolock.com/pages/contact-us

Send the info in care of Patrick Smith ....

Hope this is helpful ....

[jeffmoss26]

Div Inorum..they commented on your video.

[Divinorum]

lol oh wow I completely missed that. Thanks

[Divinorum]

I'm pretty star struck and excited that they actually found the video and took the time to respond. Kick ass I will be emailing them all the information about the lock/keys used in the video.

[nick08037]

From reading a little about their company it seems that they have a real commitment to their work and a desire to do the right thing.

I believe some time ago I saw a purchasing promo for the locksport community, I could not find anything currently. Does anyone know if this was a one time thing or ongoing? Otherwise their website appears to have some sale pricing listed for the general public on specific items.

Nick

[Divinorum]

Just a quick update. I received an email back directly from Patrick Smith at Commando Lock. I must say his response is awesome and he is very open minded Definite thumbs UP.