Pak-a-Punch question

[Nitrous]

Hi Guys,

Has anyone ever looked carefully at the depth knob and vise for the pak-a-punch code cutters?
I have one, with vise, punch and knob for the Kwikset line.

I'd like to to two things. First, I'd like to be able to "repurpose" (hopefully easier than to completely build from scratch) an existing vise (cheap, outdated vise's come on sale on ebay periodically - I've got one for a Jeep for 10$) for something like the Master Padlock series.

Second, I'd like to be able to make depth knobs. The "trail and error" method is to use an existing depth knob, and measure the depth of the indentations on the knob vs the actual depth of the cuts. Alternatively, if anyone has already done some of this, it would be nice to hear.

Finally, I'd like to make a punch and die for the Schlage series. As far as I can see, the punch differs primarily in that it is a 100 degree rather than 90 degree punch. I suspect that the flat is also different than the usual 90 or 90T. I've got a plan for making the punch/die as a precision fit - machine the unhardened tool steel rod - cut a small piece of the punch profile off the end, harden the heck out of it and use it to actually do the punching through the die material. Once everything is to shape and dimension, I'll harden the piece. Scrap the original piece of punch profile used to make the die. I've made punch/dies like this before.

I'm not out to reinvent the wheel, except so far as a guy with a mini lathe and mill likes to reinvent most everything
I can't really justify the cost of the items new but some effort and a bit of metal is always worth putting towards a project like this.

Thanks guys,

Doug

[Squelchtone]

[Moved to Key Machines from Lock Picking Pick-Fu ]

[Nitrous]

[Moved to Key Machines from Lock Picking Pick-Fu ]

Sorry 'bout that
Didn't quite know where to put it...
Doug

[Nitrous]

I hate to ask.... is this sort of question "off limits"?
I have to imagine that someone has a Pak-a-Punch that drops by this forum.

I want to be sure that if I post this as a project, that it won't be inappropriate.
Nitrous

[Sinifar]

Why re-invent the wheel? Pac a punch has Schlage depth knobs and vises for the existing. Look in any supplier catalog.

Remember - you can't punch a lot of keys especially Yale, or Lockwood. Exceptionally thick keys like sectionals are out as is Weiser. There are kits for all car keys, both foreign and domestic.

Mine is set up for IC - so ....

Just my thoughts

Sinifar

[billdeserthills]

Having a mill and a lathe isn't going to help you get the parts you make hardened properly. My experiences in the past suggest that it actually does cost less to go with a system that has already been invented, than making up my own invention. I would just buy the optional schlage kit from Pak a Punch

[Nitrous]

Having a mill and a lathe isn't going to help you get the parts you make hardened properly. My experiences in the past suggest that it actually does cost less to go with a system that has already been invented, than making up my own invention. I would just buy the optional schlage kit from Pak a Punch

Your points are well taken, however this is more of a "can I do it" not "can I do it as well as the manufacturer."
The punch and die and vice set for Master Locks only covers the M1 keys.

I think that the technology is interesting. Making a hardened punch and die is a challenge.
I understand if this is of little interest to the rank and file members of this but it's on my "to do" list

Thanks for responding.
Doug

[kwoswalt99-]

Making a hardened punch and die is a challenge.
I understand if this is of little interest to the rank and file members of this but it's on my "to do" list

Hey, I like toolmaking, and machining, and tools, and stuff like that. I know some other people on here do too.

[Nitrous]

Just as a follow up, can anyone confirm the following?

Thinking about the depth knobs for the Pak-a-punch it struck me that in the numbered knobs, the first digit defines the number of cuts possible ie if there are 6 possible depth options, the first digit will be a 6. The second and third digits ie 6XX might define the depth increments. So, a key that has 6 depth cuts, each 15thous between cut depths would have a depth knob 615.

For something like the Schlage depth knob, they depart from this convention. IE 0-9 with 0.015" depth of cuts is just a knob with 0-9 depth options but no number to designate 10 possible cuts. I suppose, if there is a convention to follow, the knob would be number 1015.

Anyone with this clipper confirm/refute or otherwise illuminate this issue?

Tnx
Doug

[Nitrous]

Just an attempt to see if anyone has gotten any further on the understanding on the Pak-a-Punch system.
Since it’s now long out of patent and no longer for sale and the parts are not coming up on eBay nearly as often, it might be time to take another look at this.

I’m particularly interested in the Schlage depth knob and vise, wonder if anyone has a set for sale or rent I’d like to make a mold of them for future experimentation .

Thanks guys.
Doug