Impressioning a Pin Tumbler Lock

[DR_WOLFSBURG]

I have a question, now i know how to do this, i know the theory behind Impressioning a lock. I can do cam locks, wafer style locks and some auto locks..

I cant seam to do a pin tumbler type cylinder. I don't know why, i just don't see any marks. I have tried everything, different lighting, magnifying glasses etc.
i just seem to be constantly breaking the keys off in the cylinder.
do any of you have any suggestions that i could try to better my skills? I practice this as much as i can on my spare time at work. I just cant...
ive even tried to run a key through a ITL9000 and do just all 1 cuts do just get the spacing right, but i still don't. blading, graphite idk. i guess im just blind.

any input would be great. This is a skill, and a dying art. im only 27 but i take my work seriously. Thank you!

[GWiens2001]

Use far, far less tension. Use a good file or fine sandpaper to smooth out the top surface of the key blade. Use a sharpie marker to color the top of the key blade. Then use it to draw a smilie face on your nose. (That won't help impressioning, but it will amuse those around you;) ).

Now put the key in the lock, apply only maybe twice (max) the turning pressure you normally use to turn the key. Now move the key bow down until it stops (again, light pressure). Release turning pressure. Reapply turning pressure and repeat a couple more times. Now look at the key, and you should see some marks.

You can also search the forum. In numerous threads, impressioning techniques have been discussed. Even with pictures.

Gordon

[DR_WOLFSBURG]

Use far, far less tension. Use a good file or fine sandpaper to smooth out the top surface of the key blade. Use a sharpie marker to color the top of the key blade. Then use it to draw a smilie face on your nose. (That won't help impressioning, but it will amuse those around you;) ).

Now put the key in the lock, apply only maybe twice (max) the turning pressure you normally use to turn the key. Now move the key bow down until it stops (again, light pressure). Release turning pressure. Reapply turning pressure and repeat a couple more times. Now look at the key, and you should see some marks.

You can also search the forum. In numerous threads, impressioning techniques have been discussed. Even with pictures.

Gordon

Thank you so much! Besides the smilie face on my noise i will defiantly try everything else lol

[billdeserthills]

I like to file the key equally to a razor edge, that way the brass key will be weak enough for the pins to give a good
sign, or impression.

If you aren't using about a 10 power magnifying glass get one and really examine the edge of the
key in bright light. Try to find the shadows, tilt the key towards and away from yourself while using the magnifying
glass.

When you go to get an impression, insert the key fully into the lock (which is held down securely)turn the key
right and lift, turn the key left and press down, now repeat several times & check for marks.

[GWiens2001]

When you go to get an impression, insert the key fully into the lock (which is held down securely)turn the key
right and lift, turn the key left and press down, now repeat several times & check for marks.

The exception to this method of left and right is when the lock, especially some padlocks, only turn one direction to open.

Gordon

[DR_WOLFSBURG]

When you go to get an impression, insert the key fully into the lock (which is held down securely)turn the key
right and lift, turn the key left and press down, now repeat several times & check for marks.

Mhmm I was pressing up on both directions. I am going to defiantly try this, i can picture how that would show more of a impression

[billdeserthills]

When you go to get an impression, insert the key fully into the lock (which is held down securely)turn the key
right and lift, turn the key left and press down, now repeat several times & check for marks.

The exception to this method of left and right is when the lock, especially some padlocks, only turn one direction to open.

Gordon

I have gotten some exceptional marks pushing the wrong way, especially on padlocks that only will turn to the right.
Pins binding are still pins that mark, whether or not the cylinder will turn far enough to open the shackle

[GWiens2001]

Thanks, Bill. Learn something new every day.

Gordon

[Raymond]

There is one other technique that is quite effective. That is to tap the keyblank with a small, light hammer. Put turning pressure on the key with your visegrips (or your favorite key holder.) Hit the key once vertically on the top. Reverse the turning direction. (This resets the pin contact on the keyblank. ) Hit once with the hammer again. Reverse turning direction and hit key once on the bottom. Reverse direction and hit key again on the bottom.

You will have exploited almost all possible directions by which the key can be marked and in a logical order. This is also efficiently quick to do once you get the feel for turning and tapping. If you get a mark, file to the next approximate depth - at least 15 thousandths.

Tapping is good especially if you have difficulty coordinating the turn and wiggle in a productive movement.

In general, repeated key wiggles or taps without allowing the pins to relax or reset is a waste of time and tends to break blanks. Presume that the FIRST impact or wiggle of the blank in contact with the bottom pin will move the bottom pin. Since it has moved, repeated impacts are wasted effort.

And, Yes, GWiens1000.00 is correct. Even if a padlock only opens in one direction, there is usually enough tolerance to mark when turning either direction.

[DR_WOLFSBURG]

There is one other technique that is quite effective. That is to tap the keyblank with a small, light hammer. Put turning pressure on the key with your visegrips (or your favorite key holder.) Hit the key once vertically on the top. Reverse the turning direction. (This resets the pin contact on the keyblank. ) Hit once with the hammer again. Reverse turning direction and hit key once on the bottom. Reverse direction and hit key again on the bottom.

You will have exploited almost all possible directions by which the key can be marked and in a logical order. This is also efficiently quick to do once you get the feel for turning and tapping. If you get a mark, file to the next approximate depth - at least 15 thousandths.

Tapping is good especially if you have difficulty coordinating the turn and wiggle in a productive movement.

In general, repeated key wiggles or taps without allowing the pins to relax or reset is a waste of time and tends to break blanks. Presume that the FIRST impact or wiggle of the blank in contact with the bottom pin will move the bottom pin. Since it has moved, repeated impacts are wasted effort.

And, Yes, GWiens1000.00 is correct. Even if a padlock only opens in one direction, there is usually enough tolerance to mark when turning either direction.

Thats really interesting, i can see how by tapping the bow of the key lightly would help the pins leave more of a viable marking on the key blade.
I am going to try this method and see what the difference it makes.
.............right after i extract the broken piece in the keyway haha

[Papa Gleb]

A lot of great advise here. Gordon I learned this lesson myself just yesterday. I impressioned a Yale padlock which only turns one direction however the other direction was giving me much better marks.

There are actually several methods aside from Wiggling and Tapping. There is also pulling and a few more which I cant remember now. But I will add the tips that have really helped me:
1. Inspect the pins in the lock, if they are sharp to a point you will get good marks, if they are dull square they may have problems leaving marks.
2. Its a 50/50 split whether to knife edge a blank or not. I generally do not because I see it as the more surface area the more places for the pins to mark. This is especially important on old heavily used locks because the pins and chambers have lots of ware which means lots of movement and Im not talking about up and down. Knife edging is my last last resort. If I am 5 blanks in and still barely any marks, I will knife edge a blank making the tip of the blade near paper thin. This way even the most dull of pins will leave a big indent. I continue to file to an angle with ever pass and this is important because if you switch to perpendicular filing you will lose the edge in turn losing the ability of the pins to mark.
3. If a lock is giving me a hard time, I will pick it, then with the plug turned, use my pick to get a rough idea of the bitting. This will tell me which pins are low and with are high not to mention give a nice confidence boost when filing.
4. Some lock manufacturers use a zero cut which means no cut at all however that zero cut pin will still leave a mark on the first pass. So after you preped the blank however you see fit, give it a pass of your liking then carefully inspect all of the marks and ONLY file the biggest ones. Try to avoid filing tiny dot marks on first pass because this could be a zero cut.
5. After I take my first pass and I see exactly where the pins are spaced, I draw lines with a marker virtually down. This not only helps with above #4 but it also lets you know if your filing straight down or to an angle so if your marks start to wonder off, you can reference the lines and see if its your filing.
6. I sometimes mark the blade of the blank with a sharpie because its faster for me however I recently discovered that using a blank marker isnt the best idea. The blank marker is the same color as the dirt and grim in the lock so switching to blue will allow you to easily tell what is dirt and what is marker.

Boy I sure did learn a lot as these tips just keep flowing and flowing out of me lol but I will stop here at least for now. I plan to make a very detailed series of videos on yt as there are only a handful currently so keep an eye out for that.

Also, let us know how it went? Did you make a working key? Lastly what lock are you trying to impression? Seeing how you have already impressioning working keys for wafer locks as you said I dont see any reason why a pin tumble would give you problems UNLESS there is something with the lock itself. Post some pics.

[Papa Gleb]

I forgot on very important note, every ones always says good lighting and magnification are important which is true however no one explains in detail exactly what lighting. Its very weird and I have yet to figure out a pattern but if I impression in my kitchen then I find the room light very helpful to see the marks but if I impression at my office, I turn the room light off and use the light from my computer monitor (blank word doc in full screen gives a nice white light) and the light of my mag. Also, my 30 or 40x mag came with 2 LED right under the mag however I block both of them with my finger. I find that with them both beaming light directly onto the blank, I cant see a thing but if I cover it with my finger, the light still passes through and gives me great visibility. Remember, when you look for marks, you are really looking for a shadow or dot of different reflection than the rest so too much light will kill that shadow. You also need to look for marks from all the possible angles so dont hold the blank in one specific angle but rather twist it around from all sides.