views on raking.

[skutter]

Im new to lock picking

Im just wondering - what do more experienced pickers think about raking as a technique? Is it considered a good technique to get a lock open but lacks the finess of setting each pin individually? Or is it technique that experienced lockers use often. From what i have read i understand that raking is not a sure way to open a lock with a pick as i am sure i will discover as soon as i move on to picking locks with security pins.


Like i say im just curious in what other peoples views are on this - I dont know anyone else who is into locking picking as a hobby so i have to ask things like this on forums.

Just before posting this i came across this article in case any one is interested
http://lockpickernetwork.wikidot.com/un ... ing-raking

[GWiens2001]

Personally, will rake with a Bogota for a few seconds to set the easy pins, then switch to SPP. Both methods have their pros and cons. A balance seems to work alright for me.

Raking can be scary fast, but tends to be less effective on locks with very high and low bittings. But there are world-class pickers who can open a vast majority of locks by raking. Then there are some like FarmerFreak who is staggering with his skill and can open just about anything using a hook.

There is a skill to raking, but it stills feels quite random, while SPP is far more precise.

Some locks can be raked open quickly, but are a bear to pick with a hook. And other locks can be picked with a hook easily, but can't be raked at all.

You will develop better feel using SPP than raking.

Gordon

[jimu57]

I go with Gordon. If I have a lock that is easily raked open then I try to SPP it, and vice versa.

[74TR6]

Depends on reason for picking the lock also. If a lockout situation and the only goal is to get a lock opened quickly, I spend a bit more time with a rake; and will try a couple of styles. For practice; I like SPP methods. With raking, it is random with little or no feel of progress.

[pickmonger]

I think that raking gets abused by a lot of beginners. I have been a lockpicking hobbiest for over ten years and know I certainly wasted time and skills raking when I was better off to have been becoming more skilled with single pin picking.

Beginners might find it a good idea to remember that many locksports practitioners see a big difference between single pin picking skills and the skill of raking.

There is nothing more pathetic to me than seeing some newbie thinking he is a great lock picker when all they know is basic raking and how to use a pickgun or bumpkeys.

I am not saying that being good at raking a lock open doesn't require skill Having said that raking is sometimes a very useful skill.

Beginners can sometimes rake open a lock (or use other opening tools) and remove some of the pins or re pin the lock to make it easier to learn and practice single pin picking.

Personally I am in two different camps.

1) The main one, where finesse with a sense of style, single pin picking a lock is considered important and the main object in locksports championed on fine sites like Lockpicking101.com. Raking when appropriate is also accepted.

2) The other camp is the Gee Wiz James Bond Camp with all the gadgets that look cool but in many cases are over priced crap. This camp if not banned ,is not encouraged by the admins of many legitimate lockpicking sites.

Simply put this site is for practical lockpicking and not a bunch of James Bond wannabees.

[cledry]

Whichever is quicker. I don't get paid to waste time.

[skutter]

As i do it for a hobby and not as a job then im in no rush - I think for me if i develop my technique for single pin picking from the begging its going to make things easier down the line.

I have two cutaway euro locks to practice on (i got them yesterday) I can rake the lock with the 6 standard pins - although it may take less than 10 seconds one time and more than 10 minutes the next so it does feel a bit random. I'm going to tackle the lock with the security pins once i feel a bit more practiced at single picking the standard pins. THe cut away locks are great asi can see what is going on but also they are machined so that the pins can easily be changed and removed using an allen key to remove a plug and the bottom of each pin chamber- so just now im working on single picking 3 pins - and didnt find it that hard - although it looks like some times all the pins are set and feels like it but the lock still wont open - my guess is that im using perhaps to much pressure on the tension wrench and that one of the pins is binding slightly as if igo over the pins testing them i can then open it - or if i switch the hook for a snake and run it over then it opens nicely - i guess its good to practice both techniques as im sure they will both be useful.

Im not so keen to go out and buy a pick gun just yet and i have seen how effective bump keys can be and from a 'prepping' urban survival point of view (i live in the Sweden and the Russians are coming according to my in laws and thats who bought me the pick set..) i can see them being something worth while - but i want to focus on using the simple set of 4 picks and one tension wrench i have.

[LocksportSouth]

Not really adding much to what's already been said, but here's my take on it.

If you're a locksmith, as cledry said, you're not being paid to waste time. If raking is faster, rake. If bumping is faster, bump. While you're doing NDE, swap between your fastest methods and if raking, bumping and pick guns don't work after a short while then you can move onto SPP. Time is money and those poor cold wet folks want into their house stat . This goes triple for law enforcement, entry technicians, red teaming etc.

If you're a hobby picker, raking will NOT develop your picking feel. There's certainly a skill to it and you can certainly improve your raking success by practice, practice, practice but it's a lot more hit an miss than SPP, as by it's nature you can't feel individual pins and certain pinning will thwart your efforts, as will many high security features. However it's quite useful to:

* As Gordon said, set the easy / standard pins first and get a quick false set ready to SPP the securities and/or tougher pins, and
* As a nice confidence booster - some locks that are hell to SPP are easy to rake (and vice versa) - if a lock is giving you hassle, whack it with a bit of raking and if it pops open, that's a nice confidence booster. You could also go to town on your Master No.3s, nothing like watching 6 locks pop open one after the other in seconds to boost morale a little .

[kwoswalt99-]

When I first started out, raking was the only thing I did. Eventually I started having more luck spp'ing locks open, so I stopped raking altogether. I never had any luck raking, and when I did it didn't feel like I had "earned" it, so to speak. One lock I still rake though are sfic's, I can't spp them for the life of me.

[Malekal]

When I first started out, raking was the only thing I did. Eventually I started having more luck spp'ing locks open, so I stopped raking altogether. I never had any luck raking, and when I did it didn't feel like I had "earned" it, so to speak. One lock I still rake though are sfic's, I can't spp them for the life of me.

I'm having a hard time with Dominion Locks... they have good tolerance, nasty biting(at least for me).

I always SPP. When I fail for a while, I will try raking but I don't have the same pride if it does open.

Then it's back to SPP. At some point if i'm still unable to open it, I shim it. Then study it to try and understand where I fail and why. Put it back together and then try some more.

I also try to impression every lock I get (Started that not long ago so only 3 so far) and also, will file key blanks for the lock, just to practice that part too.

I try to get some xp in all the little bits of being a locksmith.

[unshiftedmatt]

I'm knew to picking also,I am a police officer and stumbled on to police bypass school. Good portion of it was picking. I just used it on a hot call the other day. Little boy called in his dad was passed out I arrived but the boy was too small to reach the door knob and deadbolt. I raked the door knob and dead bolt. Opened right up, dad was fine and my chief was happy He didn't have to replace a door. I don't have time to ssp on the job but I think ssp helps you really understand a lock and shouldn't be forsaken for raking.

[ghostpicker]

Personally raking is a fine technique for a quicker method and once you develop the technique and feel on the tension it is good to have that in your skills, once you get used to raking then you'll have alot better understanding the zipping method as well.

I like to rake out of boredom on cheaply made locks just to keep the muscle memory and keep the touch and technique in shape being a spp guy,
Raking also helps me identify spools or serrated pins if i get a false set on high security stuff.

[BobbyZ]

Raking really helped me on my tension skills so far although I'm still in the beginner ranks.One thing I've learned from doing auto lockouts at work is that having a plan of action really helps.When I approach a new lock I'll rake then zip and afterwards go SPP.Even if I get it open before single pinning I'll still go and SPP and try and find out why what and how everything worked.It really helps to progress in this hobby and anything else you may do but I'm assuming that most of us drawn to this hobby think along these lines already

[74TR6]

Several have echoed that raking is often a choice for time. Called to a lockout with a realtor and banker waiting beside me, I used raking. Their only interest was quick entry; and the old expression the: time is money applies

[RumballSolutions]

Asking for views on raking vs SPP is like asking about religion or asking a bunch of locksmiths what the best lube for locks is.

It's a great debate starter and everyone has an opinion, but in the end there is no "one true path". Like all of the great decisions in life, you will determine your own needs/wants and come to the conclusions that suit you. The best way to achieve that is to explore all the options and come up with your own views.

There is no right or wrong, just what fits.