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Antique Yale 025 Combination lock with LOBC cover (pic heavy

Forgot how to dial the combination on that old safe? Think you got the right numbers but the handle is stuck? What safe should you buy? Ask your safe questions here!
Forum rules
You are posting this in This Old Safe, a public area of the forum.

Safe manipulation discussion is allowed, but safe drilling or other destructive entry is only allowed in the Advanced - Safes and Safe Locks area.

If you are a guest of the forum and have a safe you need to open, but you do not have the combination, we cannot tell you how or where to drill it.

Antique Yale 025 Combination lock with LOBC cover (pic heavy

Postby averagejoe » 15 Mar 2016 22:43

Well, I managed to luck into a nice Yale 025.

Unfortunately there was no dial with it. Once it finally arrived I found out that it also had a LOBC cover (locked on by combination). :evil:

Image

So, how the hell am I going to go about getting this off? You need the combination to line up the gates so that you can slide the cover to the side and then lift it off. There are also tabs to prevent you from lifting the cover off.

Image




So I called upon the LOCK GODS to try and get some advice. Unfortunately I think I used the wrong extension and ended up channeling "Drill Sargent" JeffMoss26 instead.

I broke out the drill and a few bits. :shock:











Unfortunately I had no idea where to drill so it took me a few tries. Billdeserthills would be proud, I drilled first instead of wasting time dicking around with it.

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Image

Once I had enough holes to let in light so I could see what I was doing it was easy to open. The slot at 9 o'clock is where you dial to open the cover and the one at 2 is to unlock the lock.

Voila
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OLDFAST, PUT DOWN THE GUN! I am only kidding... :lol:

I couldn't resist. I had to. For shits'n'giggles™ you know.
I actually bought the drilled one first and then I bought a 2nd undrilled one.

Image
Image

The one on the top has an earlier serial number so I think they updated it for the lower one. The upper one has 2 slots to hold the cover on, one on the top and one on the bottom in the middle. In the above picture with the locks open you can see on the lock case there are tabs that go into the case and then on the cover on the right there are tabs that interlock with those on the case. Once the cover is in place those prevent it from being lifted off. You have to input the combination to the LOBC index then slide the cover towards the lock and then lift it off.

On the second later lock there is a bar and it has 4 locking tabs, on the left and right instead of the middle. This prevents the edges of the cover from being pried up. The bar is secured with 2 screws and just sits over the big screw in the middle. Does anybody know the reason for this? I am guessing it is to prevent the sides of the case from being pried to the side.

So, how did I get the cover off? I used a swiss army knife flat head screwdriver to pry up the corner and keep it open while shining a bright flashlight into the gap for the external drive gear on the side while using my other hand to turn the teeth on the drive cam with a screwdriver. I then had to look into the gap so I could like up the gates correctly without a single hole being drilled.

This would not have been possible with the later generation lock.

So, lets get into it shall we? I am going with the earlier lock since it is not damaged.

On the inside of the cover you can see the patent info and model number. As well as a few other numbers I have no idea of.
PATENTED
JUNE 3, 1884
REIS'D AUG 26 1884


¤ 3479


(upside down)
025 1/2
143

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Oddly, on the bottom of the case near the bolt it says 027 1/2. No idea why.
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So, lets get into the guts. First we remove the screw holding the curb (wheel pack) into place then unscrew it. The base of that iron peg (Tumbler Post) is threaded and so is the inside of the curb.
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A quick video because pictures only is boring :P


Once that is out of the way you take out the big screw (Fence Screw) holding down the Fence and Fence gear.
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You slide down the Fence and gear then lift them out. The Fence and gear are one unit. The gear is made with a thin tube which is inside the Fence and then flared out to keep them together. This allows them to turn independently of each other. You will soon see why this is important.
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Once the fence is out you can remove the Drive Wheel. This has a gear inserted onto the bottom that meshes with the Fence Gear. You can also see the serial number on the Fence Gear. All parts have the serial number stamped into them.
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And this is why it is important for the Fence and Fence Gear to be able to move independently. When the gear is turned one way it has enough friction that it turns the fence away from the Curb (wheel pack) but when you turn it the other way it will push the fence towards it. If all the Tumblers (wheels) are in the correct place, it will open.


The case and bolt stamped with the serial number
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The Curb taken apart. All tumblers were set at 72.
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I degreased everything and put it back together with a tiny amount of AeroShell22 grease (Thanks again Mike) and it works much better now. Unfortunately this one did not have a Drive Wheel Gear so I had to borrow the one from the drilled lock. The drilled lock also had all of the original mounting bolts and the spindle nut.

The Drive Wheel Gear is threaded 5/16 x 40 so now all I have to do is find an appropriate dial and spindle and get it mounted up.
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Re: Antique Yale 025 Combination lock with LOBC cover (pic h

Postby billdeserthills » 15 Mar 2016 22:49

Beautiful old lock, I'm glad you knew how to get it apart. If you had been around here I woulda let you use a borescope.
Actually I just put away the latest safe head I swiss cheesed, I mean I hid it under a tool cart...Can't throw it away and I don't wanna look at it
Last edited by billdeserthills on 15 Mar 2016 22:54, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Antique Yale 025 Combination lock with LOBC cover (pic h

Postby averagejoe » 15 Mar 2016 22:53

billdeserthills wrote:That wasn't so bad, but if you had been around here I woulda let you use a borescope, right through a mounting hole
Actually I just put away the latest safe head I swiss cheesed, I mean I hid it under a tool cart...Can't throw it away and I don't wanna look at it


I actually have a flexible 5mm? one around here somewhere that has a light on it but the gremlins took it from the "I put it there to remember where it was" spot and hid it on me I guess :lol:

I am guessing you didn't finish reading the thread since I bought it full of holes already :P
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Re: Antique Yale 025 Combination lock with LOBC cover (pic h

Postby billdeserthills » 15 Mar 2016 22:57

averagejoe wrote:
billdeserthills wrote:That wasn't so bad, but if you had been around here I woulda let you use a borescope, right through a mounting hole
Actually I just put away the latest safe head I swiss cheesed, I mean I hid it under a tool cart...Can't throw it away and I don't wanna look at it


I actually have a flexible 5mm? one around here somewhere that has a light on it but the gremlins took it from the "I put it there to remember where it was" spot and hid it on me I guess :lol:

I am guessing you didn't finish reading the thread since I bought it full of holes already :P



I thought you already had the one with the holes in it. So you are just addicted to these locks?
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Re: Antique Yale 025 Combination lock with LOBC cover (pic h

Postby kwoswalt99- » 15 Mar 2016 23:17

Those are some nice locks. I like locks with gears! :D
How much do those usually go for on ebay?
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Re: Antique Yale 025 Combination lock with LOBC cover (pic h

Postby averagejoe » 15 Mar 2016 23:53

billdeserthills wrote:
averagejoe wrote:
billdeserthills wrote:That wasn't so bad, but if you had been around here I woulda let you use a borescope, right through a mounting hole
Actually I just put away the latest safe head I swiss cheesed, I mean I hid it under a tool cart...Can't throw it away and I don't wanna look at it


I actually have a flexible 5mm? one around here somewhere that has a light on it but the gremlins took it from the "I put it there to remember where it was" spot and hid it on me I guess :lol:

I am guessing you didn't finish reading the thread since I bought it full of holes already :P



I thought you already had the one with the holes in it. So you are just addicted to these locks?


Well, I bought the one with the holes in it and I threw in a lowball bid on the other one so that I would have an un damaged one to put on a mount.


kwoswalt99- wrote:Those are some nice locks. I like locks with gears! :D
How much do those usually go for on ebay?


These specific ones? $30-$50 but they rarely pop up as they are so old.
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Re: Antique Yale 025 Combination lock with LOBC cover (pic h

Postby billdeserthills » 16 Mar 2016 11:54

Sounds like you got the monkey on your back!
Thing is if you were hooked on drugs they have a place to help you get off,
prolly no way out if you get hooked on locks!
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Re: Antique Yale 025 Combination lock with LOBC cover (pic h

Postby GWiens2001 » 16 Mar 2016 12:20

Yeah, AJ has it bad. :)

Gordon
Just when you finally think you have learned it all, that is when you learn that you don't know anything yet.
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Re: Antique Yale 025 Combination lock with LOBC cover (pic h

Postby kwoswalt99- » 16 Mar 2016 14:49

averagejoe wrote:
kwoswalt99- wrote:Those are some nice locks. I like locks with gears! :D
How much do those usually go for on ebay?


These specific ones? $30-$50 but they rarely pop up as they are so old.


I know a guy who has a metric crapload of them lol.
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Re: Antique Yale 025 Combination lock with LOBC cover (pic h

Postby averagejoe » 16 Mar 2016 17:08

kwoswalt99- wrote:
averagejoe wrote:
kwoswalt99- wrote:Those are some nice locks. I like locks with gears! :D
How much do those usually go for on ebay?


These specific ones? $30-$50 but they rarely pop up as they are so old.


I know a guy who has a metric crapload of them lol.


Um... Does he have any dials and rings? I am looking for 1-2 lol. Maybe another drive gear as well.
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Re: Antique Yale 025 Combination lock with LOBC cover (pic h

Postby averagejoe » 16 Mar 2016 17:11

billdeserthills wrote:Sounds like you got the monkey on your back!
Thing is if you were hooked on drugs they have a place to help you get off,
prolly no way out if you get hooked on locks!



lol, here is a small portion of my collection... And this is just the safe and time locks

Image
Image
Image
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Re: Antique Yale 025 Combination lock with LOBC cover (pic h

Postby kwoswalt99- » 16 Mar 2016 20:14

averagejoe wrote:
kwoswalt99- wrote:
I know a guy who has a metric crapload of them lol.


Um... Does he have any dials and rings? I am looking for 1-2 lol. Maybe another drive gear as well.


Yes. I'd like to take some pics of his collection for you guys, it's pretty impressive.
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