newb questions (ins and outs of cheap padlocks)

[iwannapretzel]

just got into lockpicking, got the pxs-14 and went a little overboard buying cheap master padlocks, as many of them come in packs of 2 or 4 for a better value. I've got a no.1, a couple 3s, a 140, and a few of what I believe to be variations of the 140 (slightly smaller body, not brass- cheaper/lighter feel). been at it for a few days now, at least an hour or two a day, and am still not doing too hot. I can do two of the 140s in my sleep, and can open the remaining 140s occasionally- however, I can't for the life of me get the 1 or 3s. I read today that 140s have a spool as well, which confuses me as to why they are consistently easier for me. hell, I hardly even understand the ins and outs of spools, and I definitely can't discern which pin is the spool or feel false sets; yet I can do two of the 140s often in a matter of seconds still.

any idea as to why this is? would also love some advice on the ones I can't seem to get... I just can't get a feel for what is going on in there, especially with the 1 and 3s. it often feels like there are multiple pins binding, pins are always getting overset/stuck (the first one especially, since I can visually see when it does that), etc. I've heard a multiple bind is often a characteristic of bottom-of-the-line padlocks like these, since the lock is simply built so sloppy, but if I can bind a pin I should be able to set it right? I also get so much random feedback and clicks (especially 1 and 3s, again), and have trouble discerning what means what, as the feedback obviously is not from the setting of a pin the majority of the time. reaching the back pins without jamming up/over setting the first seems to be an issue as well, no matter how hard I try I very often notice that the first pin is stuck up (visually). the bitting isn't that extreme on any of the locks, and while I know that people complain about the shaft width on PXS-14 picks and how it contributes to this problem, I can't imagine that my pick is the only reason I'm constantly having issues.

does anyone ever find that nicer (yet still fairly basic) locks are easier to pick because of their tighter and more quality build, regardless of security pin features? I've heard many say that master 1s, 3s, and 5s practically open themselves, so I'm baffled that they are causing me so much trouble while I continue to progress with the 140s. I originally started with very light tension but found that with the locks I can get open, using quite heavy tension and really muscling the pin up with the pick gives me more success; I can feel the sets very obviously more with this method it seems. I started using heavier tension after the thought that it is more likely to separate the driver and key pin at the shear line, and with heavy enough tension the key pin of a set stack will stop firmly against the shear line even under decent pick pressure.

my apologies, that was a messy wall of text. anyways, any thoughts are appreciated here. thanks guys.

[Silverado]

The first bit of it sounded like you're using too much tension. The last bit, you mentioned that you started applying more tension...
Ease up on the tension a good amount and work on feeling the pin being set without it slamming into the bible like it does with heavier tension. It's something that takes a little time but you will learn to notice the pin being set.
I would recommend practicing the feel with a practice lock you can reload. Put one pin in and get used to feeling the set with one, then two, then three, all with lighter tension. You'll have it in no time!

[iwannapretzel]

okay, thanks for the advice. on the locks that give me the most trouble, I notice that certain pins often seize up/catch even when completely free of tension (no tension wrench anywhere near the lock, haha). in the most extreme examples of this, I have a couple locks that bind a pin in an overset position with no tension, or will hold an overset pin up even when tension is released. this kind of stuff messes with me more than anything... is it just a product of shitty/cheap locks? this is another reason I like the 140s... I have more of them than any other lock and it seems very hard to find one that engages in tomfoolery such as this.

on another note- some of the 140s are actually 141s with just standard pins, no security, so that explains things a little better.

[Silverado]

I would recommend blasting the keyway with some WD-40 or some other lubricant/cleaner. From my experiences, when pins are binding without any tension on the core it's because the lock is full of debris or is improperly lubricated. I bought a "US GENERAL" lock from Harbor Freight just the other day (As a toy, not to be used to lock anything, don't panic ) and when I opened it up I noticed turning the key and feeling the core rotate it felt like I was pushing it through sand and bread crumbs. So crunchy. I blasted it with WD-40 and let it set a while and sure enough as the lubricant drained out it was black and full of debris.

[rusirius]

Definitely agree it sounds like too much tension. Get the core freed up and then work on keeping a light touch. Masterlocks are the easiest lock to pick in my opinion, but it was also one of the harder ones for me to get the feel of. Maybe it was just because I was learning on them. I dunno...

As for getting a better feel of the tension needed, I've found almost every No.1 or No.3 I've encountered can be raked open with just one pull if you have the right tension... So assuming it doesn't have some crazy biting you could try that to get a feel. Use a half-diamond or something like that, insert all the way to the rear of the lock, then start with almost no tension, push up on the pick (against the pins) and rake fast out of the core. If it doesn't open try again with slightly more tension. Make sure you are putting plenty of upward pressure on the pick. Don't let it just bounce off the pins (the springs in most of these are pretty stiff).

With any luck you'll get it to pop open... Then try repeating it with the same tension... Do it a few times and note the tension you're putting on the core... Now try SPP using the same tension...

[iwannapretzel]

I would recommend blasting the keyway with some WD-40 or some other lubricant/cleaner. From my experiences, when pins are binding without any tension on the core it's because the lock is full of debris or is improperly lubricated. I bought a "US GENERAL" lock from Harbor Freight just the other day (As a toy, not to be used to lock anything, don't panic ) and when I opened it up I noticed turning the key and feeling the core rotate it felt like I was pushing it through sand and bread crumbs. So crunchy. I blasted it with WD-40 and let it set a while and sure enough as the lubricant drained out it was black and full of debris.

I know the type of lubricant is contested subject, but I used a graphite-based lock-specific lube on one and tri-flow on the other, neither seemed to help...

[Silverado]

I know the type of lubricant is contested subject, but I used a graphite-based lock-specific lube on one and tri-flow on the other, neither seemed to help...

It is highly debated as to what the "best" lubricant for locks is. I know that WD-40 can trap and hold lint, dust, and whatever else because it is oil based. I'm pretty confident that any oil based lubricant will react the same. I avoid graphite as a lubricant because, as it's been stated, it can start to cake and turn into just more debris in the lock. I've got experience with that first hand.
At any rate, so as to not turn this into a "which lubricant is best" thread, I'm just leaving it at I use WD-40 because it has done what I want it to do.

That "US General" I mentioned earlier in the thread, I can't seem to get any of the pins to set on it when picking it. I didn't spend a ton of time on it, but the spring tension on the core is so outlandish...and the core flops around inside the lock as well. Makes it really hard to put tension on it because everything is flopping around so much.
I almost started believing the horrid tolerances of a cheapo lock serves as a decent anti-picking measure. I've got to spend more time with that little nasty thing though.

[OrMeanGene]

On the progressing through locks, i really like the bosnianbill's lock progression beginner guide on youtube. I bounced around with crappy locks early on, not helping myself at all. Make your way through his list and i believe your doing pretty good. You learn a lot as you move through. He gives some pointers too.