cole semiautomatic key machine?

[Jarod]

hey i just got a old cole semiautomatic key machine, i'm cleaning it up a bit, fixing stuff on it, and i ran into a problem, i don't know what kind of oil to use on the vices, and pivot thing, in my locksmith book it says not to use motor oil, vhy is that, and could i use sewing machine oil, 3 in 1 oil, transmission fluid, wd-40 or something, i can take pictures if needed, btw, the machine fires up and when you press a lil button near the power switch it spins a small motor that pushes the vices along the cutter, and there is a spring on the vice pivot thing that appers to push the vices into the cutter, if you have any idead on the oil then i'd love to know about them, any other suggestions on cleaning it, fixing it, or adujstment or other things don't hesitate to post

[Romstar]

A good choice for lubrication is a silicon spray. If you don't have that, 3in1 shouldn't be a problem. I believe that was what we used for years on another machine.

Heavier oils will tend to hold onto the metal chips, and possibly gum up the works.

Romstar

[Pickey]

Would this be any good?

http://www.hpcworld.com/lockhpc/t_hgg.htm

[randmguy]

Not for a key machine. You get too much movement (meaning friction) on key machines. Graphite is okay when you've got a brass key rubbing steel pins at a slow speed in insertion but its not effective with a rotating shaft or the slide for your vise.

[Romstar]

I still use 3in1 oil on my key machine. A good light machine oil, sewing machine oil, or 3in1 will serve you fine in this aspect.

Pay attention to your machine. Clean it often, make sure it is in a clear, safe and clean environment and it will last you for many years.

I've seen people go after their key machine with a can of compressed air. This is a bad idea. In many key machines, the motor is open, and thus you can get brass chips inside the motor. The result is a very foul smelling, and ruined motor.

To clean your machine, use a soft, lint free cloth, a small brush such as a detail brush, or even a 1" paint brush. If it becomes dirty, use a mild detergent, and apply it to the rag. Do not spray any cleaner directly onto the machine.

Use a clean, dry cloth to finish, and carefully relubricate the machine. Pay attention to the springs, jaws, guide shaft, and in the case of an automatic machine, check all other moving parts.

After your machine is clean and lubricated, check the calibration.

Most machines will include a guide that will walk you step by step through the process of checking that your machine is in alignment.

While you do the alignment proceedure, pay careful attention to the tracer point, and the cutter. The tracer point should be replaced, or refinished when it shows wear. If you refinish the tracer point, you MUST re-align the machine, since you have changed the size of the tracer.

The same applies for the cutters. If you experience difficulty cutting, or the machine catches, these are positive signs of a dull cutter. If you have re-aligned the machine with an old cutter, and replace it, the new cutter may be slightly too large. Check the alignment again.

Also inspect the jaws, and be sure that they are square and level. Have they been dinged, or dented? Are they wearing or difficult to tighten? Do keys, or blanks wobble when you are cutting them? If you answer yes to any of these symptoms, disassemble, and inspect all parts for each jaw assembly.

If your machine is equiped with a blank alignment fork, a tip or bow stop, or other alignment guide, inspect it carefully. Has it been been nicked or cut, or perhaps jammed in the machine? Be sure the movement of the guide stops, or alignment fork is smooth, and easy to operate. If this part can be locked, be sure the locking mechanism is working, and in good condition.

If your machine uses a belt drive, inspect the pullys and belt. Be sure that the motor is securly tightened to the machine. Each pully should have a set screw, or a shaft key, be sure these are tight and that the pullys do not move. The belt should fit snugly, but have some deflection while the machine is at rest. Replace any belt that shows signs of wear, such as glazing, cracking or fraying. There should be a belt guard, be sure this guard is secure.

Check the de-burring brush assembly. If the brush is worn down, frayed or damaged, remove it and replace the brush. Be sure that the brush is held securely. If your machine has a brush guard, USE IT. Make sure it is clean, undamaged and properly in place.

Use your machine safely, and carefully. Care for it often, and it will provide you with years of trouble free service.

Romstar

[mbell]

That's funny, Romstar took the works right out of my mouth

I use whatever oil is in the can. Possibly that's why the brass chips stick.

[Jarod]

ok, i used some "machine oil" it had been used on a sewing machine,
i did not use compressed air to clean it, i think the calibration is good, but don't quote me on that,
what i did is i adjusted the key guide so the cutter just scrapes the blank, there was no manual (it was given to me ) the key guide could use sharpening, but could i use a dremel for this? the vices work nicely, as for the fork, i'm not sure if this has one, if its the thing that pivots near the key guide and comes down onto the vices than yes it does. the belt/pulley assembly is in good condition, the deburrer seems a little worn, i may pick one up soon, thanks for all the info romstar

[Romstar]

You're welcome for the info.

On the issue of your key guide, I would recomend a file, and going very slow. The dremel can gouge if you slip, and it always takes more metal than you expect.

Which model Cole machine do you have?

I may be able to scare up a manual for the thing.

Romstar

[Jarod]

its got an 1/8 hp motor, a red cover, and do you have any idea where the model # would be, i'm going to go have a look in a minute, perhaps near the motor or on the bootom of the machine, i also have reason to believe that is is a automatic/manual machine, because when you use it in automatic mode you set a little spring device on the vices that holds pressure on the cutter, and you push the button near the power switch and it moves the vices, or you can do both for yourself (applying cutting pressure and moving the vices)

[Jarod]

it says "3kcc" next to model on a plate on the bottom of the machine, thanks

[Romstar]

I will definately see what I can do.

That could be a difficult thing to find though.

Do you have the ability to take some pictures of the machine?

Romstar

[Jarod]

yea, i can take pics of the machine, i'll try to do that later today.

[Jarod]

heres some pics,
the machine with the cover on:

cover off:

motor used to push vices:

spring mechanism used to apply cutting pressure:

text on front of machine:

hope the pics helped.

[Varjeal]

Looks a little battle weary, but as long as your alignment and other servicing turns out ok, everything should be fine. Many machines of that time period were built heavy and strong, so you should get a lot of years left out of that. The cutter wheel looks fairly thin. Anyone know if this is typical of Cole machines? You might want to start shopping and invest in a new cutter as well as brush.

Best of luck with the machine, it should do you well for decades to come.

[mbell]

The cutter on that machine does look thin. Is it a mortise machine, or is it just my imagination from the photos?

Most key machines ae built to last. My Curtis machine is nearly 30 years old and it looks and works almost as if it was new.