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Is this really Mosler Safe?

Forgot how to dial the combination on that old safe? Think you got the right numbers but the handle is stuck? What safe should you buy? Ask your safe questions here!
Forum rules
You are posting this in This Old Safe, a public area of the forum.

Safe manipulation discussion is allowed, but safe drilling or other destructive entry is only allowed in the Advanced - Safes and Safe Locks area.

If you are a guest of the forum and have a safe you need to open, but you do not have the combination, we cannot tell you how or where to drill it.

Is this really Mosler Safe?

Postby fishgirl » 10 Sep 2018 20:16

I am trying to find out how old this safe is, an identify kind of lock, an is it really a Mosler Safe?
Any one out there know I would love to know. I have researched an found the history of Mosler an the serial Numbers available. I read where the Mosler Safe Co. had a fire back long time ago an the serial numbers were destroyed. The lock has 4 wheels an have had it reset. I have posted pictures.
I am new to this forum an hope I have asked the right questions.
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Re: Is this really Mosler Safe?

Postby Squelchtone » 10 Sep 2018 21:32

That's a beautiful antique safe you have there. the safe body is much older than the Mosler lock mounted inside it.

The body looks like a Herring safe, but I have to dig around and verify what I'm saying.

It was pretty common place in the 1800's for the safe maker and the lock company to be two different companies. Sort of like buying a Ford pick up truck but the stereo is made by Pioneer or Kenwood.

Your safe's lock was probably replaced at some point with that nice Mosler lock.

I have to really hit the books on this one, perhaps some other members here will know exactly what you have there.

Thank you for sharing the nice pics!

Squelchtone
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Re: Is this really Mosler Safe?

Postby bitbuster » 11 Sep 2018 0:52

Diebold-Kienzle ??
"I dream of a world where, chickens can cross the road without having their motives questioned". Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Re: Is this really Mosler Safe?

Postby fishgirl » 11 Sep 2018 7:26

Thanks for the input. We are restoring the safe. Makes since about the lock. As you can see we saw the concrete on inside of door is cracked when we removed the inside door panel.
Locksmith said the lock was in perfect condition.
It's a slow go to restore. Will post pictures as we progress.
The only thing missing is the plug that goes into the end of the dial on the combination. It is threaded.
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Re: Is this really Mosler Safe?

Postby 00247 » 11 Sep 2018 8:49

If the lock was retrofitted, it should be readily evident if you pull the lock and look for evidence. The 5H Mosler/Yale friction fence lock has a unique mounting that would take some effort to mount in place of most locks at the time. I have been told Yale made the locks for Mosler in that era. The 5H uses a spindle mount as pictured and usually has some sort of secondary mount to stabilize it which is sometimes a supporting bracket or bolts through the case. Both of these 5H variations are from Mosler screw door bank safes.

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Could the Mosler lock have replaced an original Yale? Possibly, that could be an easy changeover. I am curious about that lock as it has only one bolt going through the lock case. I have not seen one like that. If you take it out please post pictures. What is the number stamped into the wheel pack cover? I can't make it out. I could compare it to my locks as I know the year of my safes, (1891 and 1915)

Is the safe a Mosler? I can't say, but if the serial number is a Mosler one it predates 1886 which is the oldest in the Mosler serial number ledger. While I have never seen a Mosler with that ornate design, who knows what they may have built in the early years. Is the inside intact? Pictures of it may hold clues on who the maker was.
You call that a safe? Let me show you a real safe...
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Re: Is this really Mosler Safe?

Postby MartinHewitt » 11 Sep 2018 15:41

fishgirl wrote:As you can see we saw the concrete on inside of door is cracked when we removed the inside door panel.

From what I've seen this is very common. As it is not state of the art of burglary protection anyway and the panel will cover it again, this should be no problem at all.

Great safe and good that it is in caring hands.
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Re: Is this really Mosler Safe?

Postby fishgirl » 12 Sep 2018 7:32

The insides were removed before pictures were taken.
I have a picture of them.
Also this is a picture of the inside of lock where the tumblers were removed. The lock is all brass.
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Re: Is this really Mosler Safe?

Postby fishgirl » 12 Sep 2018 7:39

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Re: Is this really Mosler Safe?

Postby Squelchtone » 12 Sep 2018 7:45

fishgirl, could we please see a photo of the door open so we can see both the inside of the door, the side of the door and the opening in the safe body where the door goes into? This all helps us identify who made the safe.


a view from an angle like THIS example would be great: https://i.imgur.com/5dYhvgD.jpg

Example:
Image

Thank you!

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Re: Is this really Mosler Safe?

Postby fishgirl » 13 Sep 2018 21:07

Image

I hope this will help.
Just let me know if you need any more pictures or angles.
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Re: Is this really Mosler Safe?

Postby femurat » 14 Sep 2018 4:28

I can't see the image in your latest post. Is it just me?

Cheers :)
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Re: Is this really Mosler Safe?

Postby GWiens2001 » 14 Sep 2018 6:58

femurat wrote:I can't see the image in your latest post. Is it just me?

Cheers :)


Not just you, Femurat. Can't see it either. :(

Gordon
Just when you finally think you have learned it all, that is when you learn that you don't know anything yet.
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Re: Is this really Mosler Safe?

Postby Squelchtone » 14 Sep 2018 7:38

GWiens2001 wrote:
femurat wrote:I can't see the image in your latest post. Is it just me?

Cheers :)


Not just you, Femurat. Can't see it either. :(

Gordon



the OP manually added . j p g to the end of the album name which is located here https://imgur.com/a/jK5SpH3 , unfortunately the [image] command cannot display an imgur album, just one image at a time.

The direct image in that album is this: https://i.imgur.com/E4qj6Zt.jpg

here it is encased in [image] tags

Image
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Re: Is this really Mosler Safe?

Postby fishgirl » 17 Sep 2018 15:42

Thanks for helping with displaying the image.
Does anyone out there have any more suggestions about who made the safe. The lock does not apear to be retrofitted.
The back of the lock has 2 screws holding the back on. Also the handle was not replaced. No one had removed the inside of the door panel before.
I was reading about Mosler history an someone said that Mosler had a lock company in Kentucky back when they started making safes.
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Re: Is this really Mosler Safe?

Postby Squelchtone » 17 Sep 2018 16:51

I thought that this might be a Mosler Bahmann & Company safe, but certain features such as the knob/handle are not the correct shape.

As for Kentucky, from what I read the Mosler Lock Company made time locks for safes in Covington KY from 1920 to 1960.

Mosler Bahmann & Company started in 1867 and Mosler Safe & Lock in 1874, both in Cincinatti Ohio. Mosler later moved to Hamilton Ohio in the early 1890's.

I'll dig around some more but I don't think your safe box is a Mosler.

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