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Help with an old hotel safe

Forgot how to dial the combination on that old safe? Think you got the right numbers but the handle is stuck? What safe should you buy? Ask your safe questions here!
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You are posting this in This Old Safe, a public area of the forum.

Safe manipulation discussion is allowed, but safe drilling or other destructive entry is only allowed in the Advanced - Safes and Safe Locks area.

If you are a guest of the forum and have a safe you need to open, but you do not have the combination, we cannot tell you how or where to drill it.

Help with an old hotel safe

Postby hotel_safe1 » 6 Apr 2019 22:06

Good day,
I’m obviously new to this forum. I’ve done some searching around but haven’t been able to find any answers. Here is what I’m trying to do. I acquired an old Pacific Coast Safe and Lock Works hotel safe from the early 1900’s. I have the combination to the safe but no keys for the safe deposit boxes inside. I thought about hiring a locksmith to try and open the boxes however, I’ve found it’s almost cost prohibitive to do so. I’d like to try to open them myself. I’m retired and have lots of time to practice. Does anyone know of special picks or techniques I could use to open the boxes? I have some limited experience opening simple padlocks, desk drawer locks etc. I understand the basic concepts but I’ve never tried opening something like this. Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for your time.

Here are links to photos of the safe

https://oi1004.photobucket.com/albums/a ... wxdcms.jpg

https://oi1004.photobucket.com/albums/a ... 9ezlkn.jpg

https://oi1004.photobucket.com/albums/a ... hux29k.jpg
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Re: Help with an old hotel safe

Postby Squelchtone » 7 Apr 2019 0:34

[ADMIN EDIT: Moving thread from Lock Picks to Questions from the Public - This Old Safe.]
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Re: Help with an old hotel safe

Postby femurat » 7 Apr 2019 0:44

Hello and welcome to the forum. I like your safe, great find!

You probably know thay those boxes have one common key and one unique key. So you have to make 22 keys. It's not an easy task for a beginner, but if you have time and patience you can do it.

Read some "impressioning" topics about lever locks here on the forum so you get the idea of what needs to be done.

Knowing more about those locks would help, so wait for someone able to identify them.

Good luck :)
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Re: Help with an old hotel safe

Postby Squelchtone » 7 Apr 2019 2:10

everything femurat said above and may I recommend you spend $24 bucks and get 2 doors from this seller on ebay
it even says they come with a key, I wonder if it is the guard key or the renter's key...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/223061973446
a very good deal and free shipping!

or this one for $18 or best offer
https://www.ebay.com/itm/292305212435

This will help you understand how these work by taking them apart, without having to bust open one of your nice doors.

beautiful safe by the way,
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Re: Help with an old hotel safe

Postby MartinHewitt » 7 Apr 2019 2:21

Could you please show us one door on one photo so we can get more details about the lock?
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Re: Help with an old hotel safe

Postby bitbuster » 7 Apr 2019 9:31

Hmmm..... no lucky number box 13 in that nest. Superstition?
"I dream of a world where, chickens can cross the road without having their motives questioned". Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Re: Help with an old hotel safe

Postby Safecrackin Sammy » 7 Apr 2019 10:39

bitbuster wrote:Hmmm..... no lucky number box 13 in that nest. Superstition?



Good eye for detail!

Maybe box 13 is where all the other keys are...
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Re: Help with an old hotel safe

Postby hotel_safe1 » 7 Apr 2019 16:19

MartinHewitt wrote:Could you please show us one door on one photo so we can get more details about the lock?


Thanks everyone. Here are a couple of pictures of individual doors.

https://oi1004.photobucket.com/albums/a ... w1pigw.jpg

https://oi1004.photobucket.com/albums/a ... hasxj7.jpg

I'll take a look at those doors on ebay. That would be a great way to practice and see how they work.

I didn't notice right away that number 13 was missing. Then I looked at the last door, number 21. Well, 5 by 4 should equal 20. I asked myself what gives. Then I started counting and discovered no 13! Yep, I'll bet that's where all the keys are.

Thanks again everyone.
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Re: Help with an old hotel safe

Postby MartinHewitt » 7 Apr 2019 18:13

On the photo both look like flat keys. That makes it easer for you to make blanks or perhaps you can buy fitting ones.

You can see a few deposit locks here: http://www.prc68.com/I/Locks.html#Yale_8-Lever_

As you can see there is a huge variety of locks and there are really more than that. So without having one door open you can only look into the keyhole and guess the rest. Normally the banker's side has less levers than the customer's side. The banker's key should be the same for all of the 21 - 1 locks. Impressioning might be the easiest way to open the doors and get at the same time a fitting key, but what side to impression depends on the lock.

Video about making keys: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=raMQP3NkbCI

If you have a bit experience with lock picking, you can try something like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQcx8LNF8xk
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Re: Help with an old hotel safe

Postby hotel_safe1 » 7 Apr 2019 21:39

MartinHewitt wrote:On the photo both look like flat keys. That makes it easer for you to make blanks or perhaps you can buy fitting ones.

You can see a few deposit locks here: http://www.prc68.com/I/Locks.html#Yale_8-Lever_

As you can see there is a huge variety of locks and there are really more than that. So without having one door open you can only look into the keyhole and guess the rest. Normally the banker's side has less levers than the customer's side. The banker's key should be the same for all of the 21 - 1 locks. Impressioning might be the easiest way to open the doors and get at the same time a fitting key, but what side to impression depends on the lock.

Video about making keys: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=raMQP3NkbCI

If you have a bit experience with lock picking, you can try something like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQcx8LNF8xk



Thanks so much for the videos and information! They were very helpful. I did some research on the hotel the safe came out of. It was in business from 1907 until the mid 1920’s when it was remodeled into an office so I’m guessing the safe is likely to be from the early 1900’s. I’m again guessing that the boxes were somewhat simple and similar to the lock in the video. If that’s the case, would you be able to recommend a small set of pick tools that might help me? Like I mentioned in the original post, I’ve got some limited experience picking simple padlocks and desk drawers/cabinets. I used a modified 90 degree screwdriver for tension and a heavy paper clip. It worked ok for the real simple stuff. Bottom line is if I’m able to open at least one of these boxes to find out what type of lock the boxes have, I could go from there and it would be a great personal accomplishment.

Thanks so much for your help and all of the others who have responded to my post so far.
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Re: Help with an old hotel safe

Postby Squelchtone » 7 Apr 2019 22:47

Watch this video as well, it shows the insides and how these usually work: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFbG_GfAT6w then this video for tool making ideas ;-) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a3LPXNAFl0s

and you probably don't have to buy any picks as most of us would use the wrong tool for the job to open these.

Best idea is to improvise a lifter tool but use something better than a paperclip on this style lock. piano wire would be good if you can get some.

If you have an Auto Zone near you, go to the trash can outside, grab some used windshield wiper blades, strip off the rubber and reclaim the long thin strips of stainless steel, it would work well for this project. You can bend one piece to be your turning tool, and the other piece to go inside the lock to lift the levers into position to align the gates.

The little lock on your doors is the Guard key hole and will be the same levers in all of your 20 boxes, so once you open one door, you can decode the levers and make a Guard key from a blank and a hand file. The bigger nose keyholes on your doors are unique to each door, those will have to be picked one by one using the windshield wipers fashioned into hand tools.
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Re: Help with an old hotel safe

Postby Squelchtone » 7 Apr 2019 22:56

and this video that shows a realistic approach: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPzOIgj8wGY

edit: this is probably very close to your actual lock's insides https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=raMQP3NkbCI
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Re: Help with an old hotel safe

Postby hotel_safe1 » 8 Apr 2019 18:26

Squelchtone wrote:and this video that shows a realistic approach: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPzOIgj8wGY

edit: this is probably very close to your actual lock's insides https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=raMQP3NkbCI



Thanks for the links to the videos! They are very helpful. I guess I have enough information to get started. Thanks for the tip with the wiper blades. I had an old "backup" set in the trunk of my car but they are the cheap plastic ones. The new ones on the car have metal frames but they are still good so I'll try the auto parts junk pile. If I can't get this to work I'll order one of the inexpensive sets on good ol' ebay. Thanks again Squeltchtone and everyone else for all your help. I'll let you know when I get them all open (I'm being optimistic).
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Re: Help with an old hotel safe

Postby MartinHewitt » 8 Apr 2019 19:06

For wiper blades I just went to my garage and asked for old ones. A minute later I had few for free.
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Re: Help with an old hotel safe

Postby high_order1 » 29 Jul 2019 0:15

bitbuster wrote:Hmmm..... no lucky number box 13 in that nest. Superstition?


I'm guessing, because many hospitality properties don't have a 13th room or floor due to superstitions.

I’m again guessing that the boxes were somewhat simple


Not in my limited experience. These were made in an era when attention to detail and robustness were common.



If that’s the case, would you be able to recommend a small set of pick tools that might help me? Like I mentioned in the original post, I’ve got some limited experience picking simple padlocks and desk drawers/cabinets. I used a modified 90 degree screwdriver for tension and a heavy paper clip. It worked ok for the real simple stuff. Bottom line is if I’m able to open at least one of these boxes to find out what type of lock the boxes have, I could go from there and it would be a great personal accomplishment.

Thanks so much for your help and all of the others who have responded to my post so far.


None of the items you've mentioned will be helpful.
This lock doesn't utilize pins or wafers like you're used to, but a set of flat, thin parts called levers. You will need to make a tension wrench capable of putting significant pressure on the lock core. Also, you'll see people picking with a standard pin hook; the problem is the face of the hook is wider than the thickness of the lever, making it very possible to lift more than one lever at a time.

Maybe this is an exploitable weakness, but I am betting something that allows you to manipulate each lever individually will bear more fruit. You will need something like a cheap 'precision' screwdriver kit, that you can bend to make a short L at the end of the shaft. Watching one of Mr. Squelchtone's videos, apparently it is possible to tension one keyway and pick another in certain lock systems, perhaps yours may have the same vulnerability. Better still would be a trip to your local hobby store; buy some piano wire so you can really push up on the levers.

I appreciate the fact you feel opening the individual container locks would be an accomplishment, plus keeping what you find, but... those are not beginner locks, and you may find yourself investing some time in it. I do promise the last one you open will probably take much less time than the first one. :lol:

Honestly, drilling them out (I won't detail it here, I don't think that's a public side thing I can do) is your best bet. If you want it in truly 'restored' condition, you're gonna have to cut a key for each door, and a master. If you just want in, defeat the locks, and let the doors swing freely.

Either way, it's a beautiful piece in the rough, and with some TLC, would be absolutely impressive and show worthy!
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