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Few questions about lockpicking

Having read the FAQ's you are still unfulfilled and seek more enlightenment, so post your general lock picking questions here.
Forum rules
Do not post safe related questions in this sub forum! Post them in This Old Safe

The sub forum you are currently in is for asking Beginner Hobby Lock Picking questions only.

Few questions about lockpicking

Postby Needer » 28 Mar 2019 9:49

Hello everyone,

I'm practicing to improve my lockpicking skills, and I got a few questions that I think would really help me with that.

My first question is about the tension you apply on the lock with your wrench. I've heard many different opinions about that, but I heard a "famous" youtuber say he often applies strong tension on the locks to get a better feedback (both with the wrench and the pick). This makes sense to me, as you hear the pins set much louder than when using a light tension. Some people say that doing that might result with multiple pins binding at once, but I don't understand the problem here. In my opinion, the fact that you have 2 or 3 binding pins doesn't change anything with the fact that you have to set all the pins, no matter the order.

My second question is related to the way you have to use your pick when picking a lock. I didn't find much information about that on the internet, but from the different videos I saw about lockpicking, I gathered that one of the best ways to use your pick is to make it rest on the ledges (the protrusions of the lock that match with the key profile (not the bitting), is it called the wards ?) and to use your pick as a lever to lift the pins. I feel that this technique gives me a better feedback when lifting or bouncing the pins. What is your opinion about that ?

My third question is related to the picks you use for lockpicking. I tried to pick some locks with relatively narrow keyways. Usually, with these locks, I can't insert my pick and use the "lever technnique" above resting on the bottom of the keyway. Instead, I rest my pick on the first ledge I can (thus the first ledge that still allows me to have access to the pins). This causes the problem that I automatically lift the pins up when inserting the pick in the keyway. For example, if the 3rd pin is binding, I wouldn't be able to reach the 4th and 5th pins until I set the 3rd pin first. My question is : is that really a problem ? I think so, as you might automatically overset some pins that match with low bitting on the key. What's your opinion about that and how could you prevent this when you still need a deep hook to lift the pins far up ?

Sorry for the possibly bad english ; this isn't my first language.

Looking forward to reading your answers !

Needer
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Re: Few questions about lockpicking

Postby Needer » 4 Apr 2019 7:25

Hello everyone,

Are my questions hard to answer or completely unclear ? :)
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Re: Few questions about lockpicking

Postby RedStagKiller » 4 Apr 2019 7:36

It reads very well to me. I am an amateur at this as well so I would be no help but wouldn't mind seeing some of these answers myself.
Just an AA living in an A world.
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Re: Few questions about lockpicking

Postby femurat » 4 Apr 2019 9:59

1 - The order does matter. Otherwise where's the fun?
I always suggest light tension.

2 - I agree with you.

3 - Remember that you can tilt the pick up and down, rotate it and also insert it at an angle. You should be able to reach the back pins without lifting the front ones. Follow the warding with your pick like a maze!

And a final answer for all of your questions: forget theory, just practice and everything will become easier!

Cheers :)
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Re: Few questions about lockpicking

Postby Needer » 7 Apr 2019 9:07

Hello femurat,

Thank you for your answers !

I would like to challenge your opinion on point 1 ; when applying strong tension and if 2/3 pins are binding at the same time, I really think the order doesn’t matter at all.

Sometimes when picking a lock with strong tension, I feel like one pin is stiff (the first one who would bind when applying soft tension) and some others are « crunchy ». When setting those crunchy pins, sometimes they fall back in place, sometimes they stay set.

Anyway, tell me what you think about that, and again, many thanks for your help !
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Re: Few questions about lockpicking

Postby femurat » 8 Apr 2019 4:19

Well, if you apply strong tension, it may be possible to set 2 (or even 3) pins in a random order, and still open the lock. It depends on may factors, for example if there are security pins or not, if the lock tolerances are good or not, etc. The fact that this may be possible shouldn't suggest you to do so. You should try to find the correct binding order and follow it. Remember, you should use finesse, not force.

Cheers :)
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Re: Few questions about lockpicking

Postby high_order1 » 28 Jul 2019 23:01

You haven't gotten a lot of feedback, so let me offer you a couple of random pointers


Needer wrote:Hello everyone,

I'm practicing to improve my lockpicking skills, and I got a few questions that I think would really help me with that.

My first question is about the tension you apply on the lock with your wrench. I've heard many different opinions about that, but I heard a "famous" youtuber say he often applies strong tension on the locks to get a better feedback (both with the wrench and the pick). This makes sense to me, as you hear the pins set much louder than when using a light tension. Some people say that doing that might result with multiple pins binding at once, but I don't understand the problem here. In my opinion, the fact that you have 2 or 3 binding pins doesn't change anything with the fact that you have to set all the pins, no matter the order.


In my limited experience, only dumb or dirty locks respond to brute force. As you progress, more difficult locks are more like a mechanical watch, and require precision coupled with accurate force.

When you have multiple pins bound, you make solving the puzzle much more difficult. Yes, they all need to find the shear line, but due to manufacturing tolerance stacking errors, they go easiest when they go in order. Also, if one (or more) of the pins are security pins, and you have multiple bound, I don't think you'll be able to solve that lock at all.
Lastly, in very narrow keyways, and when the bitting is set with a shallow cut at the keyhole, you can overpick fairly quickly.

My hearing is excellent. You won't be able to hear every pin set in every lock system. You are better off learning to hear using your fingers, and feel what's happening.



My second question is related to the way you have to use your pick when picking a lock. I didn't find much information about that on the internet, but from the different videos I saw about lockpicking, I gathered that one of the best ways to use your pick is to make it rest on the ledges (the protrusions of the lock that match with the key profile (not the bitting), is it called the wards ?) and to use your pick as a lever to lift the pins. I feel that this technique gives me a better feedback when lifting or bouncing the pins. What is your opinion about that ?


There is a TON of information available. Even if they don't directly discuss it, watch their hands instead of the lock.

Using a hook or diamond as a lever is one way. The down side is that it can allow you to put way too much pressure on the pin in question. If it is a security pin, and it is false set, you will bend the pick before you put that pin in the shear line.

Turn the lock so the pin stacks are at the bottom, and drag a hook or diamond across the bottom, feeling each pin. Try picking it that way. Use that method when the pins are at the top.

Most of the time, I anchor a couple of fingers just below the lock, and use my thumb and two fingers, similar to how you'd use a small scalpel.

My third question is related to the picks you use for lockpicking. I tried to pick some locks with relatively narrow keyways. Usually, with these locks, I can't insert my pick and use the "lever technnique" above resting on the bottom of the keyway. Instead, I rest my pick on the first ledge I can (thus the first ledge that still allows me to have access to the pins). This causes the problem that I automatically lift the pins up when inserting the pick in the keyway. For example, if the 3rd pin is binding, I wouldn't be able to reach the 4th and 5th pins until I set the 3rd pin first. My question is : is that really a problem ? I think so, as you might automatically overset some pins that match with low bitting on the key. What's your opinion about that and how could you prevent this when you still need a deep hook to lift the pins far up ?


It is a problem. I have inserted the pick all the way to the back, then inserted the tension wrench, and picked outward. Also, you may choose to use a thinner or smaller pick, or use a top of the keyway (TOK) tension wrench.

And, I believe some locksmiths will intentionally pick bitting that puts a deep cut behind a shallow one to defeat lever-style picking attempts.

Again, in my limited opinion, there's not one method of picking. Different locks require different techniques to solve, for me, anyway.
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Re: Few questions about lockpicking

Postby m12lrpv » 12 Aug 2019 18:38

I've just started too and already I have found that higher tension prevents pins from accidentally moving above the shear line which is the number one killer for my picking attempts. The clear practice lock I have makes that very clear.

Higher tension also gives me better feedback on the tension wrench as it moves into the different "sets".

I have had zero success with lighter tension.

But the biggest problem is that my high tension could be the next person's light tension so I could very well actually be using light tension and just don't know it.
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