Bargain find; vintage S&G safe combo - need info

[Black85vette]

I am not really into safes and combination locks but found this at an antique store for what I considered a reasonable price. It is obviously missing some parts, but I got it to take apart and understand its operation. That was simple enough and I also took time to clean and lube it also. The combination portion of it seems to work fine. I did some searches and this looks like an early 1900 lock. The front of the dial was covered in a hardened crud at first but a brass wire wheel cleaned it up and revealed Sargent & Greenleaf Rochester NY. I would like to find an image of the complete mechanism and a description of how it works. Since this is not manipulation or any type of bypass I assume it is OK in the open forum?? If not just delete this post. Thanks, Rick

[Squelchtone]

You can 100% totally post that here, it is literally just photos of a safe lock and I don't want folks thinking they have to walk around on egg shells and be afraid to post stuff, we really try not to be complete jerks about it... Manipulation is now ok to be discussed in the general areas of the forum now, just no safe drilling or other destructive entry or bypassing.

Cool find by the way! I'm sure someone here will need that!

Very thoughtful of you to post it, thanks.

Squelchtone

[MartinHewitt]

It should have looked quite similar to this one:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Antique-Vintag ... 3789518215

[Black85vette]

It should have looked quite similar to this one:

Yes, that helps. I think I can picture the rest of the pawl hidden in the picture. Not an exact match to mine but close enough. Might be interesting to try and fabricate the missing parts. Thanks for the link.

[stratmando]

It should have looked quite similar to this one:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Antique-Vintag ... 3789518215

Picture 3 has small arrow at 74, Picture 6, looks like it may have been drilled, notch at 74 also, outer ring may have been filled in..

Black85vette, Nice Lock, Good Luck

[Black85vette]

Picture 3 has small arrow at 74, Picture 6, looks like it may have been drilled, notch at 74 also, outer ring may have been filled in..

Interesting. That is something I would never have spotted or known to look for.

[stratmando]

Picture 3 has small arrow at 74, Picture 6, looks like it may have been drilled, notch at 74 also, outer ring may have been filled in..

Interesting. That is something I would never have spotted or known to look for.

Thought it strange that the dial doesn't appear to have moved between drilling(if it was drilled), and the photos, seems dial would have rotated a bit unless froze?

[MartinHewitt]

Spindle tubes can have notches to fix dial rings in certain positions.

[stratmando]

Thanks

[Black85vette]

Warmed up a bit today. Enough to make it comfortable in the machine shop. Thought I would make an attempt to fabricate the missing parts based on photos of how this lock worked. I find it enjoyable to reverse engineer things to figure out the geometry and interaction of parts. So this is somewhat a rough layout, trial fit, make changes, repeat. Until it starts to come together. The bit on the back of the pawl is a brass rod soldered to the pawl. This is will not be used for anything other than demonstrating how the lock mechanism works. I will likely make an oak stand to mount it on. Anyway, pretty satisfied with the way it turned out and happy that I had enough scrap bits of brass that no material was needed.

[bitbuster]

Bravo, well done.

[stratmando]

Nice work, Wonder if it needs a Spring?
If you have an engraver, you could do some squiggly lines
like the other parts, Then Salt and Vinegar, Heat in Oven to 450 then Vinegar til it is close to original.parts color.

[Black85vette]

, Wonder if it needs a Spring?

A spring would be useful but not essential for demonstration purposes. If it were going to be actually installed and used a spring would make it operate more reliably. I saw one photo with a spring to pull the pawl down. Wheels have to be lined up perfectly for the weight of the pawl to drop it down into the slot.

What is the purpose of the engraved lines?

[stratmando]

Would look like the rest, Hope someone has info or history on the etching. See it once in a while

[GWiens2001]

, Wonder if it needs a Spring?

A spring would be useful but not essential for demonstration purposes. If it were going to be actually installed and used a spring would make it operate more reliably. I saw one photo with a spring to pull the pawl down. Wheels have to be lined up perfectly for the weight of the pawl to drop it down into the slot.

What is the purpose of the engraved lines?

They were used for decoration.

Very nice work!

Gordon