Space & Depth keys - what's spec?

[Peter Martin]

I ordered a set of 10 spacing & depths key for Yale pin tumbler (on Y1/999 blanks).
The key depth cuts consistently seem to be about .004" to .006" too high. I presume that this is out of tolerance, but maybe not. I was expecting them to be around +/- .002".

I measured with a Mitutoyo dial caliper which I believe is pretty close.
But since I'm not sure whether there is a manufacturer's tolerance listed anywhere, I thought I'd ask.

Pete
Sioux Falls, SD

[GWiens2001]

Which spec are they cut to? There are two Yale cut specifications of which I am aware. .019” increment and .025” increment.

Google “Yale cut specifications” for more information.

Gordon

[demux]

I believe Yale actually has several different DSD systems. Many of them are probably quite esoteric and not in actual use, but do exist. I'm seeing a couple different systems just in the .019 increment.

Pete, I'm sending you a PM with a link to a document with a bunch of DSD info for several different systems, I've found it very helpful when trying to find stuff like this.

(Gordon, I got this info from this forum so you may already have a copy, but I'm happy to share with you or anyone else that's interested, I'd just rather not post it publicly.)

[Peter Martin]

The Yale code keys are supposed to be cut to the .019" increment depths: .0320", .301", etc.
They are generally .005" high over the spec depths.
I do not see that any of the manufacturers list a tolerance for their key depths. Is there such a tolerance given by manufacturers? (I'm thinking not).
P.S. I do not see such a thing on the HPC card index (thank you Demux).
Pete

[femurat]

To be clear... this is a Schlage example, but you'll get what I'm after.
There is a .002" depth tolerance for the key cuts.
1. Has anyone seen a similar tolerance for Yale?
2. If you get a set of Space & Depth keys for a Yale .019" series, and those keys were .005" too high, is it unreasonable to return them, or is this within the manufacturer's tolerance?
Pete

[demux]

The Yale code keys are supposed to be cut to the .019" increment depths: .0320", .301", etc.
They are generally .005" high over the spec depths.

There are a couple options here. The first is that your caliper is out of calibration, though as you said above that's not very likely. More than likely the key was cut wrong. It should be easy enough to find out. If you have some cylinders, pin them up to the bittings of some of your space/depth keys (111111, 555555, etc) and see if the keys work. At that far out of spec, you'll be able to feel quite easily if the depths are wrong. If they're cut high, it'll feel sticky in the cylinder and hard to turn.

To be honest, this has happened to me more times than not, even from some of the reputable merchants. I quit buying space/depth keys years ago for that reason. I'll either cut the keys I need directly on my code machine at home, or if I need a space/depth set out in the field with me I'll cut them myself. I always try to cut my space/depth keys to very tight tolerances (I usually go for +/- .001) since any errors there will be systemically introduced to any child keys.

I think a lot of places that sell space/depth key sets actually duplicate them. If you were buying a set, I'd look for someplace that states outright that they cut them all first generation on a code machine.

[GWiens2001]

I believe Yale actually has several different DSD systems. Many of them are probably quite esoteric and not in actual use, but do exist. I'm seeing a couple different systems just in the .019 increment.

Pete, I'm sending you a PM with a link to a document with a bunch of DSD info for several different systems, I've found it very helpful when trying to find stuff like this.

(Gordon, I got this info from this forum so you may already have a copy, but I'm happy to share with you or anyone else that's interested, I'd just rather not post it publicly.)

If you are referring to the HPC DSD manual, I have it. And it does help a lot for some locks. Even printed a hard copy for here at home. If that is not what you have, please send me a link.

Gordon

[demux]

If you are referring to the HPC DSD manual, I have it.

Yep, that's the one. I figured you did, I think it's been circulated a couple times here before.

[RubberBanned]

Peter, if your keys are too tall, I would be happy to either re-ct them for you, or make you the S&D keys myself. I've found several vendors just don't make sure their keys are accurate before shipping.

[Peter Martin]

Peter, if your keys are too tall, I would be happy to either re-ct them for you, or make you the S&D keys myself. I've found several vendors just don't make sure their keys are accurate before shipping.

PM coming to you.
Pete