A simple question for pinky and the other uk locky's

[Hyperion]

Hey all

Do you think it's worth me typing out a letter and sending it round a few dozen locksmith business asking them if they're taking on apprentices or offering any part time work even??

Regards Hyperion

[Al]

Simple answer. Yes

But don't be too discouraged if you don't even recieve a reply.

My first job was from walking into a locksmiths and leaving my details. I had background knowledge and some skills that I'd developed from my long interest in locks. If you can display an understanding of the trade it will really help.

[acl]

Hyperion,where you based?
Andy

[pinky]

always a chance, as al says dont be upset if you get no replies, but keep badgering them.
you will find most are 1 man bands, but you may strike lucky, if you dont ask you dont get, so always worth a try.

[Hyperion]

acl Preston is Lancs

Not so many L-Smiths in my area really, when I started looking through the yellow pages and Thomson local and others, there are 1 or two, which are the Big Firm type places, and a couple others.

I will email/write a letter to all those that I can, heck I am even prepared to up ship and move if I get the opportunity to train under someone.

For me it's all about a career, I know I have to work at it, and I know it's not going to be quick and easy, but I have found my passion and I am going to pursue it..

Thanks again for the advice people great bunch of people on here....

Regards Hyperion

[Hyperion]

gotta get my spell checker looked at hehe

Why did I or did it put an s instead of an n for is/in ? hehe

Wish we could edit the posts though

Regards again Hyperion

[mbell]

I pretty much agree with what everyone else has said. I was in your position a matter of months/weeks ago, then I ran out of people to write to/phone.

I wrote to locksmiths from all over the North of England which I thought were most likely to take me on - probably 30+ companies and I got a phone call from one and a letter from one simply explaining NO in more words.

Good luck.

[MrB]

I think it most likely that unless they have more work than they can cope with, or good solid plans for expansion, the business owners have no reason to take on any help. You would probably get similar responses from many kinds of business, not just locksmithing.

[Hyperion]

Well I am going to give it a try that's for sure.. Like people often say, "if you don't try, you will never know."

In my mind people who aren't, or wont take on apprentices, are simply missing out on passing on knowledge the right way; to keep the profession alive with new blood and just keeping it going in general with the right sort of well trained people, is just what taking on an apprentice does.

Heck even the GOVERNMENT is all for apprenticeships now, they're screaming at core business owners or rather the hands on types of professions, to start taking apprentices again.

The Government realised that jobs were not being filled, and that too many people were going to college and Uni for office type white collar jobs, and nobody was going into the hands on trades anymore because nobody was taking on apprentices.

It worked so very well in the past with these types of professions, why not now?

And I would think it's an absolutely crucial part of this particular profession for a L-SMITH to just take on at least one apprentice so he knows he is ensuring that the profession is going to receive at least that one guy with the RIGHT SORT of training and experience. I happen to think that's a very powerful argument for apprenticeship schemes.

Not everybody, and I include myself in this most definitely, can afford bloody £600 to £1000 for a 2-5 day course let alone more money on top of that for further training, not unless the trainers are willing to come up with some types of payment plans.

Tools can be built up over time, as most people who work with tools know, but the training is, for this particular profession, costly to the extreme, in fact it's bordering on the,
"what do I get when i finish my training, titanium picks and a Shiny New Transit Van?" hehe

I know the knowledge is costly in and of it's self, of course it is, but I think, nay I know for certain that the better way to get trustworthy, honest, well trained and loyal people into the industry to start up good firms, or indeed carry on in already well established firms, is for L-Smith's to start taking apprentices again, and giving people a chance to prove themselves.

If nothing else it would put the future of the Trade into the hands of the right sort of well experienced people, instead of, as allot of the lockies in here say, '2 day trained Cowboys'.

Don't take that the wrong way anyone by the way
I am just saying that it makes sense in so many ways to take apprentices in a profession such as this, that I am puzzled as to why it doesn't happen on a regular basis.

Like I said, even the Government wants experienced professionals in all manner of hands on professions to start taking apprentices again, heck they're even giving aid to firms and financial incentives to help with them.

And I am sure that the Government and Law enforcement agencies would rather future lockies were experienced well trained people who trained under similar well experienced people, you no? It just makes sense.

Anyway rant over with heh

Now time to print out a few more letters

Regards Hyperion

[acl]

I agree most locksmiths would rather see guys go into apprenticeships rather than do a 3 day course and set up in business straight away(and no im not having a dig at anyone on this site.
The problem i see is training someone up for 4 or so years can be a costly and time consuming business and i think a lot of locksmiths are worried that theyll put all that effort in only for the trainee to leave and set up in business on his own.
Andy

[pinky]

if industry became governed and properly, statements by the mla guy on house of horrors proves for me that the mla are not the guys to do this, so if a real honest non political body took control of industry, i would be happy to cease training next day.
i am to give up novice courses, as i am starting to believe these unethical to industry aims.

sadly if as stated this mla guy is one of the top boys, then i have no interest in mla and would not consider joining, especialy if the top guys lie on national tv in order to profit from the drill.
i was on tv tonight, and spoke of the fact that no healthy lock needs drilling, all locks can be picked by true locksmiths, im an independent nobody who cares about the industry i serve, the mla talk of drilling , it seems so sad that the supposed leading industry body lies to the public in such a casual way.

ive spoken to the bbc guy who filmed me, and hes interested in a follow up with an mla spokesperson present, as well as an mp, and senior police officer, i wonder when i refer to this on tv, will the mla back on tv their top boy or will they hang him out to dry.

[acl]

Hyperion,i forgot to add ,if you keep looking you will find someone to take you on im sure.
Best of luck
Andy

[toomush2drink]

hyperion the situation your in is the same as i was in 6 years ago and it seems nothing has changed. I thought i could get some sort of work as i had 12 years key cutting experience behind me but that didnt help. In the end i changed to a financially secure career in able to amass the funds to go it alone by myself. I did a 2 day course plus another day on the bs picks but over the 6 years i was learning all i could anyway to help. I must have laid out 10k on the business but im achieving my dream even if it is a challenge. When i read your post i actually thought you were in a good position as you dont seem to have much competition that is something to use to your advantage in my eyes , well just a thought.

[Hyperion]

I take, as always, all your points in, as always they're valid and well grounded.

pinky, I am keen on this whole TV debate you have had, is it something that's coming to TV in the future? what, were and when did the MLA say do??

By the way, I didn't mean via any indirect way, to put down the training side of your business pinky, from what I have read on the forums, you're are recognised as the right man to see, and well respected... just thought I would add that in case you thought I was having a go

acl, thanks I will keep soldiering on as they say, and try and contact as many people as I can in and around my area.
I can understand your point about trust though entirely... for a lockie to train a guy for a few years and then have that person leave and set up a business in direct competition with you, is quite frankly not good business sense, and would be a kick in the goolies no?

Probably some sort of written and binding contract with the trainee/apprentice would be a way around that...
Something along the lines of,, trainee agrees to stay onboard said company for a period no longer than blah blah, and some other clauses about business competition.

For me it would all be about getting in the industry and learning from an experienced lockie, so long as the wage reasonable, not after any Porsches or anything here, just a livable wage from a job I have a passion for..
That would do me for a good 5-10 years, and I am sure it would be bang on for a lot of others wanting in also.

Setting up ones own business these days is a big step any ways, and full of risk.. not to mention the financial pressure of getting it out of the red and into profit...

any..ways.....

toomush2drink... yeah I maybe be, but, and that's a BIG BUT, the ones in and around my area will be there for a reason and they will be well established.

My Town has just become a CITY it's one of the latest ones in England to turn from Town to city, so I suspect more business will be flooding in now...

I am under no illusion however, that the market is wide open were I live, there a good few lockies in my area, just not as many as I suspected and from what I have seen elsewhere.

Any ways once again thanks for the advice and general chit-chat guys

Regards Hyperion

[pinky]

the date for the debate hasnt been set, they are talking about it and must see if everyone will appear.

dont think you was haveing a pop, im just looking to future , and i feel recognised training schools in total nde opening is the way forward, and not 2 day intro courses to industry, not all , but alot of these guys are adding to problems, i want to be part of the solution and not the problem.

with so many people with little to no experience now teaching its another area being abused, this too needs legislateing and controling, as you now have people with limited and bench only knowledge teaching basic courses, so tutor with no experience = candidate with even less and when candidate then starts teaching, it then escalates to what standard ?

im looking at a formal training school option at present and will keep you informed.