bought a combination lock, how do you get the code for it?!

[master in training]

it will really apply mainly to UK people since it was bought in a UK shop, but other people feel free to contribute!

ok, so, i went to a shop called Wilkinson's, its like a pound shop only they sell some other more expensive things too, i bought this dial combination padlock from there for £2.99, it has numbers 0-39 on the dial and seems quite secure, the thing is, how would you open it if you didnt know the code? the dial is really hard to turn and sticks a lot, it is not smooth like a safe and does not click as it goes round, it like scrapes and you can hear the sound of metal on metal grinding inside the lock as you turn it. is it broken or just cheap and rubbish? it seems quite secure.

[quicklocks]

a padlock shim should open this type of lock

[master in training]

it would, but im looking to get into safe cracking and that sort of thing and thought maybe a combo padlock would be a good place to start. i guess not!

[MrB]

There are so many threads on this subject...look for threads about Master or Dudley combination or combo locks.

Basically, some people think that if you pull the shackle and read off the sticking points on the dial, you can deduce the combination from some pattern in the numbers.

It's not clear whether this is universally true, or just an accident though.

[TOWCH]

The only safes this would be applicable to are direct fence. Cheap fire safes tend to be direct fence and so are some old school, real safes.

[master in training]

i know, i've read them, but its not a dudley or a master, its some cheap thing i dont know the actual make of other than "Wilkos", there are no actual sticking points since it sticks everywhere! thats what makes it so difficult, you cant do it by touch either becuase of the same problem.

[TOWCH]

Try pushing the shackle down.

[master in training]

tried that, and pushing it up and leaving ti alone and pulling the dial out a bit and pressing it down a bit, it doesnt make any difference, sorry! its probably just cheap and crap. never mind!

[digital_blue]

master: This will not gain you any relevant knowlede for safe cracking. The principles applied are totally different. I am also of the opinion that the other threads on cracking these by feel are incorrect in their premise that sticking points somehow relate to the combination. Have a read through Matt Blaze's paper on manipulation and you will understand that the method employed for manipulation can't be translated to these type of locks.

Sorry to burst your bubble chap.

db

[master in training]

oh ok, thanks for clearing that up db, its a shame, but i suppose i couldnt really expect to learn anything from a £2.99 lock!

i'll read through the paper by blaze and see what i can do. most conbination safes seem to be in the region of thousands of pounds, so i cant afford any. i'll just have to wait until i get more money i suppose.

[digital_blue]

For a lot less you can buy a group 2 lock (S&G for example) from ebay.
All you need is the lock, not the safe.

db

[master in training]

im going to look around for some suppliers of locks, not just ebay, but other places so other people can get them too!

[keysman]

I am not familiar with the specific lock you have but try this:



The combo is most likley 3 numbers . Lets say 12-24-16 is the correct combo


To open
Spin the dial 3 or 4x to the right . (counter clockwise CCW) stop on the 1st number (12)
Turn the dial CW 1 FULL turn past the 1st # (12) stop at the 2nd # (24)

Turn the dial (CCW) to the 3rd # (16) and pull the shackle open.

To find a number of the combo:

spin the dial a few times stop on "0" pull up on the shackle . now turn the dial, it should only move a little bit
IMPORTANT: note the amount of movement of the dial it should be 1 -1 1/2 numbers ( lines)
repeate this all the way around the dial noting the amount of movement at at each "stop" .
One of the "stops " will be different.. the amount of movement will be greater than the others, this will be 1 of the combo #'s

You have just taken the possible combinations from 46656 to 1296.

[keysman]

sorry

59319 possible combinations to 1521

[master in training]

i tried this, but because of how cheap the lock is, there are no specific sticking points, it grinds all the way round, so you cannot define between the points that stick and the points that just grind, if you understand what i mean.
as for pulling up at 0, that happens to be part of the code its 0-9-21, but if you go to one number either side of the code numbers, its still works, this just shows how cheap it is and badly made because the gates must be too big and so allow numbers to work either side.
thanks for the idea though, i may just buy anotyher when i save up the money and take it apart to find out why it grinds and try to crack the combo's.