Is this a new method of cutting to code ON THE CHEAP

[Shrub]

I am not sure if done before or commercially available but i have come up with an idea for cutting to code on a normal copying machine !

It is my idea to make some strips of steel/stainless/brass etc of around .5-.6mm and to cut depth cuts on them ,

What would happen is this, you would have a strip of metal with a no 1 cut in the no1 pin position, you would have a strip with a no1 cut in the no2 position going up to a no6 cut in a no5 position (or whatever for your lock)
I know its a lot of strips eg 7 depth cuts at 5 pin spacings = 35 slips unless you can use them back to front halfing the number to around 16, but if homemade its a lot cheaper than buying somthing the time it takes to make them is worth it to me,

To make a key up for example 23515 you would get the slips which corrispond to the cuts and put them all together to make a key of the slips, this key would then be put into the cutting machine so a blank can be cut 'to code'

If you have any better ideas i would love to develop it, i have thought of 1 strip that has grubscrews in so they can be wound out to the correct hight but wouldnt be as accurite as the above method.

[Rockford]

Known as depth and spacing keys.

[raimundo]

Depth keys were the common way to cut by code before the machines that made them less necessary. for each lock manufacturer, the locksmith kept a ring of keys, each key was cut to a uniform depth all along, like a schlage set would have keys cut to depth one and between the cuts there would be the little eggtooth to indicate spacing. One set of shlage keys covering the depths 1 through 9 to the six pin length would suffice for all the schlage keyways. The locksmith put the key for the particular depth in the machine, and cut one space, then moved to the next requried depth key for the next space. To cut one key to a code took only a few minutes longer than the code machines of today, but the few minutes add up when the job is many keys. Any locksmith that dosent cut himself a set of these even today, will be hurting if anything happens to his code machine or if he does not carry a code machine on out calls.

[Shrub]

Oh At least its a tried and tested method of doing it then,

How do you cut depth keys if you have no code machine to begin with?
Is it ok to measure 'new' original keys and cut and file the blanks to size?

Otherwise, where is the best place in the uk to get some sets? and what sort of cost are they?

Thanks for your help.

[digital_blue]

There are depth charts available online. Combine those with a dial caliper and you're set.

db

[Shrub]

Thanks db,

Any chance of a link before i start searching? no worries if not just trying to save time,

Well done on the mod thing by the way

[Shrub]

Ive searched for a while now and cant find any charts,

I have had more usful hits on this site but still no charts or links, i also searched useing db's suggestion in another thread of 'cut depth chart' but get nothing on the net,

Has anyone got a link for charts firstly for yales and then any others,

Thanks.

[digital_blue]

I have a PDF with some including Yales. PM me with an email address and I'll send them along.

db

[skold]

Well when i want to cut keys to depths i have a cylender and a packet of pins, firstly i put a pin in and see how much it extrudes from the top of the cylinder, next i grab my dremel with one of those small cylindrical cutting tools and cut it down until that pin is perfect.

Then its just a matter of repeating.

it takes me about a minute cutting a key to code that way.

[MrB]

That sounds like a good plan, but how do you get the spacing right? And how do you control the sloping edges to each cut so the key can be inserted and removed from the lock smoothly?

[skold]

Well i use one of those posca paint pens and go over the blade of the key, because the paint is poor it scratches... well i put the pins in and push the key in then wiggle the pins a bit..which leaves the marks that i cut on the key.

to make the key smooth i got over the sharp edges with the same cutting tool..easy as pie

[Shrub]

I did the same sort of thing but now i have a key machine and the old method was a pain for master key systems,

I am thinking of making my depth keys out of brass plate instead of key blanks, that way i can mill them to size and not use all those blanks up (i can get hold of brass bar easier than blanks as i have to order the blanks but can go down the road for brass stock), i will make them so the brass sits at the back of the holder so they are always at the right height in the machine so the key profile wouldnt matter,

Anyone have any thoughts on this or are you all going to tell me commercial ones arent blanks either i havent found that many pics where you can actually see the depth keys properly yet,

[Shrub]

I am thinking of making my depth keys out of brass plate instead of key blanks

Sorry i meant steel strip, perhaps even hacksaw blades,

Am i right in thinking that i have to use a symetrical cutting wheel to code cut as i cant see how you would get the proper key form just useing the dovetail side and face cutter most machines come with,


Also are there any charts for mortice locks or should i start measuring? if so a link would be great.

[fixer]

The reason for using depth and space keys is that the angles and the flats are already correct and can be copied with a duplicator.

I made my first set of keys using 'first keys' that I got from a friendly locksmith. These all had the bittings stamped on the bow, so I just cut these depths on 9 different keys.

[Shrub]

Depth keys were the common way to cut by code before the machines that made them less necessary. for each lock manufacturer, the locksmith kept a ring of keys, each key was cut to a uniform depth all along,

No angles here, are you using somthing like a bump key then?

No-one has answered me whether you have to use a symetrical cutter for code cutting or not but i guess useing somthing like a bump key style gauge you would be able to cut the angles with a normal dovetail cutter.