An Encouragement for sport groups.

[Varjeal]

Greetings,

This is just a short note to encourage users to begin (if you haven't already) forming either formal (preferrably) or informal sport groups. In order to make this sport a successs we must start encouraging new people to take up this sport if we want to see it take on the popularity of others at any level.

Hopefully relatively soon we'll have a model for N.A. region to follow (mostly likely based on the model as proposed on the other side of the pond) for all to copy and institute as they like.

So while your enjoying your sport, talk to others and see if they too would be interested. That's all I had to say.

[cracksman]

Any chance we could get a spot on the forum so we can start to map where the members are. We might be able to then figure out logical places to meet.

[digital_blue]

This site is a great place to meet ppl and to discuss our hobby, but if the model of local clubs is to take off, it will require us all to go out there and drum up interest in the real world. Start thinking about this. More to follow, hopefullly quite soon...

db

[Santos718]

I doing what I can from where I am. Already got a couple of people to buy picks and lots of locks. But there is still much to do.

[pip]

.

no offense, santos
but are you selling homemade picks to others
have you tried them out - are they good quailty picks ?
my point here is
we are trying to encourage people to get interested in locksports
make it easy for them
let them try a kwikset with only 3 pins and a rake
and then explain how it could be more challenging
if you can make a profit in the process - fine
but the main idea is " encouragement for sports groups "

if you are making your own picks
find out who is really interested
and maybe give them a rake and a diamond - for free
and don't forget a talk about lp101 ethics
ex - lock ownership

[zeke79]

I have introduced several individuals to the sport of lockpicking, gave away beginner sets to each of them, and explained the theory behind the operation of standard types of locks found in the US. The hardest thing I find for myself is that I have a hard time finding people I can trust with the knowledge. I would say I could get about a dozen or so people together but it never works out over the long run. I have tried having a groups of 5 meet together. I supplied all of the tools and locks. It seems to work until people hit that initial learning curve going from say the Master NO 3's then to the Kwiksets on to the schlages without security pins. After that most loose interest when moving into anything with any type of security pin. The lock I find that does this quite often is a master 141 or a schlage 5 pin with 2 spool pins. I guess as long as they are picking its fine but to pick the same cylinder over and over all night is not practice which some seem to do. Who am I to step in and tell them to stop doing that? Should I step in and explain that it is not helping them learn anything? I do not want to seem like these are student/teacher meetings. I want them to be fun, individualistic meetings where everyone feels free to explore new methods. I hope you understand what I am asking in the above questions, I just basically want to know how I can start the group and offer advice, and teach the methods I know without discouraging the others from exploring new methods of bypassing or picking. I am all for the idea of a locksports group in my area. I however will not fund the entire operation . Others will have to bring along locks which at this point has not happened yet. It makes no sense for me to purchase more kwiksets and schlages for others when I need that money for more advanced tools and cylinders for myself (I'm selfish ).

Maybe an established set of rules and guidelines for operation of a group would help some of us in a rut get started out more successfully. Is there any 1 person "Head" of the group? Does the group have a Council to vote in new members? How are new members introduced to the group? How are the groups usually funded? Answers to some questions like these will help out immensly.

Something else that may help out would be a list of group activities that other locksport groups do such as contests, games, awards, etc.

These are just some thoughts and questions I had. Maybe some of you who are in a locksports group can help me out with.

Thanks
Zeke79

[Santos718]

but are you selling homemade picks to others....
.....if you are making your own picks
find out who is really interested
and maybe give them a rake and a diamond - for free
and don't forget a talk about lp101 ethics
ex - lock ownership

No I'm not making my own picks, and I am refering them the lp101 ethics.
A friend of mine saw me picking a padlock a couple of days ago and became interested. I let him use my picks and asked if he wanted to try, and he told me that this would be a good hobby for him to get into. He found it as a way to build his patience.

[quicklocks]

[digital_blue]

zeke: Those are all excellent points that you bring up. There has been some work being done to that effect in the background for some time. I will be posting more concrete information by the day's end that should address much of what you brought up.

db

[digital_blue]

Hello boys and girls!

It is my great pleasure to announce the formation of Locksport International! For some time much work has been underway to develop a framework which will aide in the formation of local lockpicking clubs. So to help you all understand the point of Locksport International, let’s start with the mission statemtent:

The mission of Locksport International is to promote the hobby and competitive sport of lockpicking internationally, to aide in the development of the lockpicking skill of its members, and to provide a safe and fun environment where people can meet and exchange ideas.

Locksport International will be made up of local clubs operating under the umbrella of one organization. The benefits of this structure will be consistency amongst local clubs, the access to resources, and a streamlined method to starting a local club without having to “reinvent the wheel”.

We have already laid the foundation for this organization, and are at the stage where we are looking for people interested in starting a local club in their own town or city. Members will be issued Member ID cards (very cool, laminated, with photo) and will also receive quarterly newsletters (electronic, to keep costs down) updating them on the goings on of the association and its members.

We have a charter in place which can be found at http://www.geocities.com/digital_blue_site/LSICharterPDF.pdf. I encourage you all to have a read over it.

For the first year of operation, or until the need for a change should present itself, the officers of Locksport International are as follows:

President: Varjeal
Administrative Director: digital_blue
Treasurer: Frostbyte

The duties of the officers are outlined in the charter. We are here to help anyone interested in starting a Locksport International chapter, so please feel free to approach any of us for information. For simplicity, I’ll outline the basic duties of the officers here:

President: To oversee operations and act as an official spokesperson for the organization.
Administrative Director: Work with chapter presidents to aide in formation and promotion of local chapters.
Treasurer: To manage day-to-day financial operations and be accountable for such.

Since format of club meetings and promotions fall under my heading, please feel free to address all questions on this topic to me.

As is often the case with this type of endeavor, I’m sure many people will have their own ideas for how this undertaking should be run, what things should be in place, etc. We are all open to suggestions. Feel free to contact any of us directly, or better yet, please direct suggestions to locksport@gmail.com (for the time being, though that will likely change in the not too distant future).

If you are interested in forming a local club and would like to get more information or discuss any aspect of this, please feel free to contact me/us.

Thanks!

db

[zeke79]

zeke: Those are all excellent points that you bring up. There has been some work being done to that effect in the background for some time. I will be posting more concrete information by the day's end that should address much of what you brought up.

db

Sounds good. Hopefully a group can get started in my area. The other problem is being in Illinois . Some locksmiths really do not like nonlocksmiths picking locks for fun much less starting a locksports group if they were to find out about it considering you are supposed to be licensed to perform locksmith work in illinois. Some of these locksmiths are fairly close to my area from what I have heard from some other locksmiths who are A-OK with my hobby.

I am just worried how to handle the state licensing issue of locksmiths and what is considered locksmithing practices by law if a group were to be started. Alot of trouble could be stirred by one disgruntled member or one denied applicant very quickly which could turn out to be a sticky mess for the group. The media could really have a hay day with that one.

[cracksman]

Wow db

Very nice work, looks like you did your research!

a couple of quick questions:

1. Official Website?
2. Dues, how much?
3. Application - where, when?
4. Last part (F) of charter, indictment of a crime is not a sign of guilt (if it was we would lose half our politicians) I've been arrested on felony charges, but I have passed a check by FBI and State and Local authorities to be a teacher and class A pistol permit holder (concealed carry). I would hate to think that I could not be an officer because I have a record
-sorry, nit-picking
5. I see you have elections in May, does this mean your hoping to get clubs up and running by next May?

This undertaking has obviously taken a lot of time, effort, and serious thought. Thanks, I think the creation of LSI is brilliant. Anything I can help with let me know

[digital_blue]

Hey zeke. The legal issues have been discussed to some extent by Varj and I, though this is an important area that we will have to "feel out" as we go. These issues will have to be addressed on a chapter by chapter basis, as the regulations will change from place to place. One of the roles of the president of a local chapter will be to meet with local law enforcement to discuss the formation of the club and "get them on our side" so to speak. Obviously, it is important that local laws be observed.

We have put some things in place which, hopefully, will help to keep the law content with our club and satisfied that nothing untoward is going on, but time will tell how this will be received in specific cities and towns.

If you (or anyone, for that matter) are interested in pursuing a local club in your area, I would be more than happy to discuss the finer points of where we're at so far, or feel free to post questions in this thread and myself or the others will try and address them as well as possible. Bear in mind that though much of the foundation has been laid, this association is still in its infancy and many details will need to be worked out as we progress. The more active involvement we have from the lockpicking community, the sooner this will take shape.

Cheers,

db

[Santos718]

On the subject of legal matters.

According to local laws here in the states(atleast some states anyways), ownership of tools used to partisipate in locksports are illegal to own unless licensed. Many hobbyists do not have the proper license to operate these tools. Wanting to start a chapter, but not being licensed to have these tools would result in a immediate revoking of membership(if chapter has been created), because of it being an infraction of local laws.
According to Article V Section C of the LSI Charter states:

When the individual LSI Chapter promotes itself or its views to the
members, the public, or the media, it shall abide by all Association
policies and act in a legal manner that best represents the spirit of
the Charter and the Mission Statement of the Association.

By acting in a legal manner implies abiding all state regulations. And being a member of LSI would be legal, but owning the proper tools would however be illegal.
My question is:
How would this issued be addressed if a hobbyist would like to be a member of LSI?

[digital_blue]

Hey cracksman! Sorry for the late reply. I guess you posted your questions while I was composing my response to zeke, so I missed it originally. Here's what I can tell you.

1. Official Website?

Coming soon. Will announce within the next 3 weeks. Domain is already secured (thanks to Frostbyte for that).

2. Dues, how much?

To be announced. We are working over the budget needs atm. Likely in around $30US per year... but don't quote me on that. Obviously this is being run as a non-profit and the officers are not receiving any payment for their time. All dues collected will go directly into the operation and growth of the organzation. We are working out just what that "right" amount will be to keep it affordable for those intersted while providing enough of a budget to be effective.

3. Application - where, when?

Coming even sooner. Applications will be made available by the end of the week I expect.

4. Last part (F) of charter, indictment of a crime is not a sign of guilt (if it was we would lose half our politicians) I've been arrested on felony charges, but I have passed a check by FBI and State and Local authorities to be a teacher and class A pistol permit holder (concealed carry). I would hate to think that I could not be an officer because I have a record
-sorry, nit-picking

Valid point. We'll look at that. Perhaps "conviction of a crime for which you have not received a pardon" would be better suited. We do want to be carefull on this point tho, because this type of organization could end up attracting a great deal of media attention and I think it is paramount that we maintain the integrity of the organization. I want little Johnny's parents to feel OK about him getting involved with LSI. It amounts to breaking down the public perception that there is something untoward about lockpickers. I don't know the details of your legal situation, but would the above ammendment suffice?

5. I see you have elections in May, does this mean your hoping to get clubs up and running by next May?

Well, it is my hope that we have clubs up and running well before then. The reason for the May elections is that often clubs of this nature do not meet during the summer months due to low attendance (vacations, cottages, etc.) so the thought is to hold elections in May so that it's dealt with before the new year starts up in September.

The intention is that the chapters will elect presidents and treasurers democratically once they are up and running, though in the initial stages presidents will be appointed buy the association board. This is a matter of practicality, since when there are no members, there are no elections.

This undertaking has obviously taken a lot of time, effort, and serious thought. Thanks, I think the creation of LSI is brilliant. Anything I can help with let me know

Yes, it has, and thank you. This has been in the back of our minds for some time and it is very nice to see things starting to take shape. I certainly appreciate the interest that people are showing. The best thing ppl can do now is start working on getting a local club together. It doesn't have to take much. Just 3-4 members who wish to meet regularly will suffice to start. We'll worry about building membership once the chapter is established. Since part of my duties is to work with the presidents of local chapters, I will make myself available to help with building up the club and promoting it.

I hope I've answered all your questions. Keep 'em coming!

db