Key Bumping

[NKT]

Bump keys aren't a way to pick a lock, they are a bypass method.

I've tried it, and it is trivial to open 90% of the locks I tried. From under a second for some of the cheap Bird cylinders I tried, slightly longer for some of the others.

Scary how simple it was to open the Mul-T-Lock Garrison. First time, three strikes, four seconds. Breath-taking. First lock I ever bumped.

Also, the billiard explanation is wrong. It seems right, but it isn't. I have yet to work out the truth.

[E-Mind]

the correct explenation is the row of metal balls that when you swing the right most ball at the row of balls, the balls transfer the energy to the left most ball and since it has an equal mass as the right most ball, only it swings up.

Basically all the sides of the cuts touch the buttom of all the pins and when the key is struck, energy is transfered to the top pin causing it to bounce up - leaving the buttom pin in place.

[pinky]

Very X factor , the truth is out there.

[Mad Mick]

...the row of metal balls that when you swing the right most ball at the row of balls, the balls transfer the energy to the left most ball and since it has an equal mass as the right most ball, only it swings up...

Newton's cradle.

[E-Mind]

excuse me - "X Factor"? what's that?

[NKT]

Should we really be talking about bump keys in the open area? Or are they now so common as to be allowed? After all, they aren't picking.

I noticed that TOOOL have a new note on the front page about a TV slot they did, and they are testing manufacturers locks for them for "bumpability". There seems to be a bit of press there...

[cracksman]

NKT wrote:

Also, the billiard explanation is wrong. It seems right, but it isn't. I have yet to work out the truth.

I know I'm going to stick my foot in my mouth again but here goes:

-by billiard, 2 balls lined up touching, cue hits first ball, energy transfered to second ball which moves, first ball stays still, cue generally backs up (english or backspin) Same thing with the metal balls that everyone use to have swinging back and forth on their desks. NKT can you elaborate why you think this wrong. Has anyone recorded a bump with a practice "open" cylinder?

-The only thing I can think of if NKT is right is that the small forward motion of the key would temporarily force the bottom pins to seize as they would be pushed upwards at an angle, yet still travel up enough to give the top pins a knock

In any case it is an interesting subject, I think it took me as long to bump a Sargent dimple with a 3 pin sidebar as it took to pick my first lock, so much for quick entry

[vector40]

Bumping seems to have been de facto recognized as acceptable for the open forums, NK.

[kodierer]

I don't really understand bumpkeys. I would like to try to make some with a file, but I'm not sure how to.

Alright then. Get a key decoder for the model of lock you are going to try and bump. Then file your key down with an impressioning file. file each cut until it fits into the decoders lowest depth perfectly. If you are concerned about where to file, then use an impressioning method to mark the blank, or key to show where the pins are.

[digital_blue]

There's been a little indecision about discussion of bump keys in the open forums. For the time being, no formal rule has been enacted but the issue is still a little bit up in there air. I tend to be of the opinion that since Toool has released such comprehensive information on the subject, trying to restrict this info on LP101 is like trying to catch a waterfall in a dixie cup. Nothing's really been settled though.

Cheers.

db

[NKT]

TOOOL aren't discussing it in quite as much depth though. Klaus demo's it, and gives a brief description, and then wows everyone.

It is true that the Genie is out of the bottle, though. Some people are going to work it out, but I think the specifics about how to work one out shouldn't be discussed...

...but that's just me.

[pinky]

but had they not been discussed, how would you have learnt about them ? after all matts site is on public access and is far more explicit.

if we decided to ban all tool talk, then 101 would have nothing but whats your computer called threads in public areas.

101 is fine as it is , and many including yourself have learnt from this valuable resource as have many others.

[NKT]

That's true, and it will give manufacturers an added incentive to fix the issue.

Still worrying, though. If the UK press pick up on it, we might just find locksmithing becomes a regulated trade in the UK, but not on our terms.

Still regulation would be good, so perhaps it would work for the best.

I just don't want to think that the bypass that causes the issue is one some bar steward got off here.

Ah, morality. Where would be be without it?

[kodierer]

NKT: It is true that the Genie is out of the bottle, though. Some people are going to work it out, but I think the specifics about how to work one out shouldn't be discussed...

Even lockpicking isn't discussed in a manner that gives away the end of a movie. There isn't much more that can be said, than what can be read freely about lockpicking in the MIT, and other known guides. People read the manuals to get an idea, and then play from there.
Bump keying is not much different. If you read the white paper, and watch the TOOOL demonstration, then you should be able to work out a bump key, and use it on your own with a little playing around.

However bump keying is a higher security threat than other bypass techniques such as certain impression style methods. It is known that inserting a thin piece of foam, or foil into certain locks, and wiggling it around can cause the pins indent the material until they catch the sheer line, and the lock opens. Those style of bypass methods require more luck, and are less effective than bump keying persay.

[NKT]

This is true.

I think the line is really "how effective would this be for a criminal prepared to buy one?" - if the criminal could buy the whatever, and use it for great harm in a few minutes of trying, I think it would be something that should be restricted at least a little.

However, something like picking, which requires a lot of work to perfect (if you ever do) is far less likely to be abused.

There are always some who will abuse whatever it might be, though. Tequila, handguns, computers... There will always be something else to ban, and something someone is crying about.

The question is, which area do bump keys fall in?

You can argue the former, because they are quite easy to use, or the latter, as they are quite hard to make, and they leave a big mark on the lock...